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  #31  
Old 09-24-2012, 03:28 AM
goose22 goose22 is offline
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xshovelfreak, does the new se upgrade come with the ring gear? I have a 07, stock 96" motor and drained my primary yesterday to find a broken tooth in my drain pan. Pulled the primary cover off to find two more teeth inside and and all 3 broken off the starter ring gear.
Hopefully the ring gear comes as an assembly with the SE comp. upgrade.
Also, are any special tools required for the job? Thanks
Ok....my bad, after further review I've REVERIFIED I need to do more research before I open my pie-hole!
I see now that the ring gear is behind the clutch and the compensator is mounted on the crankshaft and that it couldn't possibly come as an assembly, unless of course, I walk into the dealer and purchase a new bike.
Big thanks to everyone for keeping this forum filled with great information!
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  #32  
Old 09-24-2012, 12:49 PM
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Travel limiters in your tappets will also help with this problem.
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  #33  
Old 09-24-2012, 06:47 PM
xshovelfreak xshovelfreak is offline
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Originally Posted by goose22 View Post
Ok....my bad, after further review I've REVERIFIED I need to do more research before I open my pie-hole!
I see now that the ring gear is behind the clutch and the compensator is mounted on the crankshaft and that it couldn't possibly come as an assembly, unless of course, I walk into the dealer and purchase a new bike.
Big thanks to everyone for keeping this forum filled with great information!
Look at it on the bright side. When you're in there doing the ring gear, do the compensator too, and you're good for a lot of miles trouble free. At least on THAT side of the bike.
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  #34  
Old 09-24-2012, 11:20 PM
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I still don't understand how a compensator fixes this problem.

My 2005 was notorious for the starter kick back and it had the older (good) style of compensator. I know my problem was associated to the higher compression. This would only get worse when hot when the bike had a chance to heat up the trapped mixture before I could hit the starter.

What's different about this starter 'crunch' problem from the kick back that caused Sportster knee and launched plenty of guys tryin to kickstart their bikes?
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  #35  
Old 09-28-2012, 12:55 AM
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Nobody knows, or everyone accepts an answer that the compensator is the problem without asking questions?
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  #36  
Old 09-28-2012, 01:10 AM
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Nobody knows, or everyone accepts an answer that the compensator is the problem without asking questions?
I dont know but when i got the "starter crunch" thing i did ask around and some people said that they just changed the starter or replaced the starter clutch and it was fine for them. Since i was dealing with this issue myself, i bought both the starter clutch and the SE comp. Not wanting to spend the $250 for the comp i dove into the starter first. Seemed fine til it got hot and then the crunch came back. Back in i go and tear it down. I replaced the comp and havent looked back. No issues at all anymore. I was told the bad comps will eventually take out the starter. Maybe i didnt even have to rebuild my starter
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  #37  
Old 09-28-2012, 01:20 PM
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I dont know but when i got the "starter crunch" thing i did ask around and some people said that they just changed the starter or replaced the starter clutch and it was fine for them. Since i was dealing with this issue myself, i bought both the starter clutch and the SE comp. Not wanting to spend the $250 for the comp i dove into the starter first. Seemed fine til it got hot and then the crunch came back. Back in i go and tear it down. I replaced the comp and havent looked back. No issues at all anymore. I was told the bad comps will eventually take out the starter. Maybe i didnt even have to rebuild my starter
I'm just trying to understand if this is more than one problem. In the past we had a burly compensator sprocket. Evo's would starter stall, or kick back (starter crunch), Shovelhead kickers would launch guys when kicking back, Early twin cams with hot rod parts raising compression kick back (starter crunch)....

My point is that this is not a new problem. I've not seen the SE compensator sprocket and my 2005 had the old style compensator. My TC95 would kick back stone cold after sitting all night 1-2 times a week, and the same thing after work. If I stopped for gas or a butt break, I'd get kick back majority of the time. When I had comp releases, I never, ever had a problem. Without comp releases, if I rolled the bike backwards a few feet in gear, never, ever have a problem.

You were right to rebuild the starter, because that sound you hear is the primary chain, basket and starter bendix stopping the engine from starting backwards. The crunch is hardest on the starter gears and bendix.

On my high compression Evo, installing travel limiters in the tappets fixed the problem 99% of the time. My buddy with a 113" twincam ran travel limiters too because his bike wouldn't start with compression releases... In both of these cases the limiters keep the tappet from bleeding down and creating an artificially short cam duration. If I had kept my 2005 RG I would have put limiters in the tappets.

I'm assuming that the crap Twincam compensator used for a few years adds *another* reason to have this problem. I'm just not understanding why. Hence my questions and outloud thinking...
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  #38  
Old 11-09-2012, 10:39 AM
RoadGlide0611 RoadGlide0611 is offline
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Well I've had issues with my starter and primary noise. After reading and doing home work I decided that I'd change to a se compensator. But, one of the parts sellers ( m & m) told me about this new compensator. I just bought it and should be in in a couple of weeks. http://www.mandmcycles.com/detail.as...uctNo=MM002844
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  #39  
Old 11-09-2012, 10:45 AM
RoadGlide0611 RoadGlide0611 is offline
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Also bought a Hayden tensioner. So I've just replaced the starter clutch and with these other parts, I should be set for awhile, until I find more Harley defective parts. I have an 09, and usually got a new bike every 2 years, but with all the mods and upgrades I've made, I just don't want to start over. That's going to eventually be a problem for Harley . I can't be the only one.
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  #40  
Old 11-16-2012, 01:47 PM
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I still don't believe the compensator will fix kick back. I researched the compensator problems with the 96" and up and all I ever found were issues with excessive wear and noise. The compensator in my 2012 is sure as hell loud so that backs that up.. lol

Harley went to auto compression releases in the 103's for a reason, and It's a safe bet they did it to address the starter kick back problems. Travel limiters work well in my experience, but they can be noisy. Not that the lifters in the 103" aren't noisy at start up already...

Long story short, I hate to say this and I hope you prove me wrong, but I suspect you will still have starter kick back problems with the new compensator.
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