No ECM Calibration Needed - Road Glide Forums
ECM/Fuel Management systems ECM/Fuel Management systems For Road Glides

 4Likes
  • 1 Post By RGKen
  • 2 Post By HellInABucket
  • 1 Post By RGKen
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-20-2019, 01:28 PM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Panama City, FL
Posts: 10
Garage
No ECM Calibration Needed

I just got an email from Nightrider about their XIED for the late model M8 engines. They said the ECM on these bikes are "self adjusting" and upgrading to slip-ons and better AC no calibration is needed. Said the calibration for these mods are due to Harley marketing and uninformed Harley technicians. They said the only issue may arise at >3500 rpm at full throttle. Most do not ride in that range.

Any thoughts about this?
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-20-2019, 01:55 PM
Life Member
 
RGKen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Jax, FL
Posts: 3,753
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just got an email from Nightrider about their XIED for the late model M8 engines. They said the ECM on these bikes are "self adjusting" and upgrading to slip-ons and better AC no calibration is needed. Said the calibration for these mods are due to Harley marketing and uninformed Harley technicians. They said the only issue may arise at >3500 rpm at full throttle. Most do not ride in that range.

Any thoughts about this?
They do adjust but they can't make a lot of adjustment overall. Very limited relatively speaking. If you were just doing an A/C or just slip-ons it could adjust for that and you would be fine. It will try to adjust if you do a complete stage I and get you closer but would not the best tune for your bike. Looking at the email I would ask myself that if the tune is not right at 3500 and WOT, how close is it really in all other areas? Just because it would work doesn't mean it is good for the bike overall. I personally would want the best possible tune I could get even if it cost me another $400 for a tune or tuner.


That part about uninformed HD techs also has me scratching my head and makes me think they are spouting BS. I believe the techs know what works best but they also work for the MoCo and give recommendations as the company would have them do so.
geo8866 likes this.

2018 FLTRXS
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
RGKen is offline  
post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-20-2019, 01:58 PM
Life Member
 
HellInABucket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 1,731
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just got an email from Nightrider about their XIED for the late model M8 engines. They said the ECM on these bikes are "self adjusting" and upgrading to slip-ons and better AC no calibration is needed. Said the calibration for these mods are due to Harley marketing and uninformed Harley technicians. They said the only issue may arise at >3500 rpm at full throttle. Most do not ride in that range.

Any thoughts about this?
He's an engineer and has been designing this product for many years. He's likely correct about the ability of the bike's ECM to adjust to mufflers and AC, but you'll not find much agreement with that sentiment from all of the "experts" on the various forums.

Personally I think if all you are planning to do is slip-ons and AC, the Knightrider FLV-ieds will do great. I've used them in the past and they work great, and they are affordable.

Regarding "most do not ride" above 3500, I'd say thats not terribly accurate. Fair enough to say that most do not spend much time above 3500, but if you've ever accelerated onto the highway, you are way above 3500. Granted not for long, but still.

Also, keep in mind that HD and its various representatives want to sell you products and services. I'm sure the techs are sincere, but they're so used to making these recommendations that its just become standard talking points.
RGKen and geo8866 like this.

2018 FLTRU
Roll away the dew...

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
HellInABucket is offline  
 
post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-20-2019, 02:34 PM
Prospect
 
Erilflynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Old Bridge, NJ
Posts: 232
Sounds like another warranty buster.

2019 Road Glide
2016 Street Glide Special (Gone)
2015 Kawasaki 1700 Voyager (Gone)
Erilflynn is offline  
post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-21-2019, 08:58 AM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Panama City, FL
Posts: 10
Garage
The FLV-ieds and XIEDs are why I contacted Nightrider, but they are not available for the new bikes until mid summer. I'm more of a plug and play guy than a tweaker. Some love the multitude of settings they get with tuners and are constantly tweaking it.
post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-21-2019, 09:25 AM Thread Starter
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Panama City, FL
Posts: 10
Garage
Email word for word From Nightrider

From Steve M.

We are in the process of updating the software of our FL-AFXIED-17 products to improve M8 compatibility.

But fear not. There is no technical reason to update or modify your bike to add exhaust and/or air cleaners. The HD ECM is designed to modify injector opening times to ensure OEM fuel mixtures are maintained. By monitoring the O2 sensors in closed loop operation, the ECM knows how much it has to adjust the injector opening times and maintains a history over the past 2-3 hours of what has changed. This "Adaptive Learning" capability is common to all late model motorcycles and automobiles. In fact the HD uses a Delphi ECM that functions almost identical to the EFI system used in Silverado, Camaro, and Corvette. You would never take those vehicles back to Chevy for EFI upgrades after changing exhaust/ac. What is the difference? Nothing other than HD Marketing and under-informed mechanics/service personnel.

The bikes are not "lean" from the factory, nor do they go lean when changing exhaust, air cleaner, or removing the converter. The ECM will use the Adaptive Learning designed into its software to maintain OEM AFR's.

This does not mean that a little extra fuel might not put a bigger smile on your face. It usually does, but the simple fact is that the ECM is designed to take care of itself and does a good job of it.

So you can do your upgrades. Most riders do like to make exhaust changes. We usually recommend simple slip-ons with a 1.75" or 2.00" inner core to maintain low/mid range power while providing a more robust rumble. There is no overwhelming reason to change air cleaners. While the change can improve power, most of the improvement occurs over 3000 rpm at 100% throttle. You spend almost all your time riding under 3500 rpm and 50% throttle, where the power improvements are minimal. So there is a mismatch between where you ride and where additional power show up (something you really will not feel).

Hope this helps.
post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-21-2019, 10:25 AM
Life Member
 
RGKen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Jax, FL
Posts: 3,753
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
The FLV-ieds and XIEDs are why I contacted Nightrider, but they are not available for the new bikes until mid summer. I'm more of a plug and play guy than a tweaker. Some love the multitude of settings they get with tuners and are constantly tweaking it.
If you plan on running this product, and it does seem like a good option for the plug and play guy like yourself, I would get rid of the CAT as running a richer mixture will only make the CAT hotter. So get some open headers you like or drill out the stock pipes to get rid of it.


I'm now curious as to what he will say about that claim that I just made...
Big_gary likes this.

2018 FLTRXS
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
RGKen is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Road Glide Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Intervention needed... Danno1873 Road Glide Builds-Document your builds HERE --NEW 23 05-21-2014 08:00 AM
some clarification needed before Audio Install PBR300x4 / 4 Polk Dxi 651 RGU Scootin Audio 13 02-03-2014 12:14 PM
o2 sensor needed? jcmer22 Intake and Exhaust 1 08-01-2012 10:57 PM
Ecm calibration upgrade for 2007 big twins mea4dxl ECM/Fuel Management systems 3 11-18-2011 09:34 PM
Needed to get on the Bike Today Nevadasun Road Trip Discussions/Stories/Pictures 10 09-11-2011 07:24 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome