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  Topic Review (Newest First)
10-25-2015 10:38 AM
DONVITO Well heres my $.02. I saw the video when it was first posted. Now comes the litigation, and at least here in Calif they have this thing called shared responsabilites.
What no one sees here is all the cars that these bikes passed before this incident, now pull up to the scene and give their statements to the actions of the riders leading up to this point, if they were being reckless they may or may not like the testimony that comes out in court.
Also, that rider should have been watching the drivers face as he was approaching and passing him, a car only goes where the driver is looking so to speak. Which may have given him some reactive time to evade the collision.
10-22-2015 11:25 PM
Knisley This happened in my new town (moved here about a year ago). Hope to be able to do my civic duty as a jury member soon!
10-22-2015 03:35 PM
Bleachey While I have been reading all of the responses and digesting all of the comments I notice a trend, which is also a natural instinct. Many people are trying to point to one person for blame. I have done many risk assessments and lessons learned/after action reports. It is extremely, almost never, one person or one factor to blame for a failure. One of my favorite processes to use is the fish bone diagram. Imagine a fish skeleton, with contributing factors being the bones that extrude from the spine. Each bone is a factor that contributed to the result, or head. You can even have factors that led to factors so it can become quite complex. You can then weight or rank each factor. It is a great visual to illustrate how avoidable a lot of situations are.

While I totally agree the biggest factor in this particular accident was the douche-bag driver of the car, maybe as high as 80%, you cannot dismiss the riders responsibility for speeding and passing inappropriately. Does this deserve the resulting action of the driver and release him from responsibility? Absolutely not, but it does need to be considered as a factor. If the rider had not been passing illegally, and we assume speeding then the accident would have been avoided. This is a dangerous path to go down, because you could ultimately reach the conclusion that riding is unsafe, leaving your house is unsafe, hell just living will kill you eventually.

I have over the past few years helped teach my 3 kids how to drive and one of them to ride. The discussions and instruction about how to operate a vehicle is the the easy part. The hard part is trying to teach them the required skill of constantly evaluating risks, visualizing escape routes and anticipating the actions of other drivers. I can honestly say that in this case expecting a driver to swerve into your line of travel is unfathomable. I have had it happen while I was driving a car on the way to my wedding and had to lock up my brakes to avoid an accident. The only way we survive as a society and are able to operate vehicles without constantly hitting each other is the expectation that other people are going to follow the rules and behave normally. Otherwise pure chaos will ensue. Hopefully the driver will have his license revoked forever, especially considering his lack of remorse and repeated offenses from reports posted here.
10-22-2015 01:51 PM
2tallnwide
Quote:
Originally Posted by reds4 View Post

QUESTION...Dose anyone think the type of bike may have promoted this? She won't watch the video, just what I described.
She says type of bike! We've seen em

I say type of inexperience and exposure

Sport bikes do tend to bring out the hooligan in riders. Although I would think being on the sport bike should have made it easier to avoid the collision as they are usually more nimble.

Some people have a propensity for riding fast regardless of what they are riding. That's why I don't own a sport bike, sport touring bike, VMax, Rocket III, etc.....but, anytime there is a passenger involved I ride much more conservatively.

Anyone that's ridden 2up much at all should know the added weight changes the characteristics of the motorcycle, and mama definitely ain't gonna be happy if you hurt her.

As for experience, even experienced riders will occasionally target fixate, make simple mistakes, take foolish risks, and ride over their abilities. I have, my friends have, and I'm sure a lot of others have as well. Unfortunately owning up to our mistakes, and taking responsibility for them are things many are unwilling to do.

Even when it's not our fault, we should still try to figure out what could have been done to avoid, or lessen the severity of the incidents for future reference. This is something I had hoped would come about from this video. It's a lot less painful, and expensive to learn from others mistakes.

Watching them land on the pavement brought back some unpleasant memories for me as well. It's a stark reminder of how quickly a fun ride can turn really ugly in the blink of an eye.

Ride safe y'all.
10-22-2015 12:44 PM
Chuck1073 To an extent, I think she's right for two reasons.

1. sport bikes are cheap, for the most part, compared to baggers. That means, in lots of cases, younger, less experienced riders. By the time we've grown up enough to afford something like an RG, we've also gotten past the "go fast/prove something" phase.

2. sport bikes are fun to go fast on. I still own and ride one. Took her out for some "exercise" yesterday. The urge to carve corners is strong. (try to save my "go fast" for the track. Where it belongs)
10-22-2015 12:30 PM
reds4 [QUOTE=2tallnwide;3012489]

^^^ I hear that n raise you one

99k on our 03 FLT, 98k shes been on back
add another 70k her 2-up with me on baggers.

QUESTION...Dose anyone think the type of bike may have promoted this? She won't watch the video, just what I described.
She says type of bike! We've seen em

I say type of inexperience and exposure
10-22-2015 11:27 AM
2tallnwide
Quote:
Originally Posted by reds4 View Post
And that's ..................just pisses ya off don't it

Some of the reactions of motorcyclists on another forum is what frustrates the heck out of me.

They continually rail on the driver like we don't get he is an asshat that needs to be dealt with accordingly.

The rider here has his share of responsibilities as well. First, and foremost is the safety of his passenger. He obviously failed miserably in that regard.

Yes I know the driver put a swerve on him intentionally, but had it been a distracted soccer Mom, texting teen, etc, etc, the rider's fate would have been the same because of his lane positioning, and lack of control of his motorcycle.

Those things are worthy of debating, and it's the area where we can learn from another's mistakes to help avoid making the same ones ourselves.

The double yellow is a traffic infraction. I'm not worried about it other than had the rider waited, or passed one by one at a lower rate of speed perhaps the crash would have been less severe, or not have happened at all.

Just the way I see it.
10-21-2015 09:23 PM
RGKen
Quote:
Originally Posted by reds4 View Post
And that's ..................just pisses ya off don't it
I hope the biker takes everything that guy owns... and then some.
10-21-2015 09:16 PM
reds4
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2tallnwide View Post
And that's ..................just pisses ya off don't it
10-21-2015 09:16 PM
RGKen
Quote:
Originally Posted by 09Sharknose View Post
The rider didn't try to get into a road rage fight, he tried to pass him on the open road. The only person that had road rage was the cager. It would be different if he was hit by an oncoming car, or pulled over by a cop. He had no way of anticipating that a car going the same direction would intentionally hit him.

Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
That is actually my main point. You should always try and anticipate that they are trying to hit you. He passed using the right half of the lane and if he had been in the left half and been expecting the car to jump in his lane, intentionally or unintentionally, he could have most likely avoided the whole thing. Bottom line is that both rider and passenger will thankfully recover and will learn from this and hopefully they will be set up to live very comfortably for the next several years by the drivers insurance company while that guy sits in a cell.
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