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BJ, Mike's reply about seeing if Alex could get you a tune for is probably the best advice yet. That is next level stuff for sure. You don't win comps like he does by luck. He has hooked me up with stuff and Ive hooked him up with a few things. Real good guy, no BS.
 

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Discussion Starter #22
BJ, Mike's reply about seeing if Alex could get you a tune for is probably the best advice yet. That is next level stuff for sure. You don't win comps like he does by luck. He has hooked me up with stuff and Ive hooked him up with a few things. Real good guy, no BS.
Alex said that if I go down to Miami for a weekend he would tune it for me. I don’t know if he’ll be willing to do anything remotely, and I’m not going to press my luck in asking. I feel like he wouldn’t want his name associated with a generic DSR tune that he didn’t get to hear and adjust, and I don’t blame him. Once I actually decide what to put in it and get it together though I’ll definitely try to find a time that works for him to ride down there for a weekend for that. Worth the trip for sure!

Following Henry’s suggestion of sticking with the Diamond Audio amps and putting one on each side of the head unit under the wings is definitely a solid idea. My hesitation is that that would still leave a little power on the table for the MPKs, and the SVs with lots of room. Neither the HXM800 nor the SD800s would max out the SVs, but it’s 40 and 30 watts more (respectively) per which is like 30-40% more power.

SO, I‘m considering putting a DA HXM800.4 on top of the headlight where I had the Micro84u, and putting the Micro84u under one wing. That gets the MPKs and SVs to 120 watts each and the Micro84u maxing out the 6x9s and four horns.

If I REALLY want to go nuts I could add a Micro4v2 under the other wing and set it up like:
  • DSR Front output to HXM800 channels 1 & 2 to MPKs in the upper fairing
  • DSR Rear output to HXM800 channels 3 & 4 to SVs in lower fairing
  • DSR 3rd stereo output split to Micro4v2 to ST25s on channels 1 & 2 (mounted on the front face of my saddlebags pointing at the back of my legs); and the DA MO75Ts on channels 3 & 4 mounted in the upper fairing grills
  • DSR Sub output split to both inputs of the Micro84u to four Unity69 6x9s (two per channel) - mounted in a new set of Advan Black dual 6x9 lids
Instead of adding two more 6x9s I could also use the third amp to power two 8” Mids in the bags, but that would require another DSR on top of everything else, and I’d lose bag space.

The drawback to four 6x9s in the lids is that I have no experience with the dual 6x9 lids to know how they sound, and I’m not sure I love the way they look.

Sorry for the rambling! I’ve just got to decide if I want to run four 6.5s; two 6x9s and four horns OR four 6.5s; four 6x9s and four horns - and if I want to add one or two Diamond Audio amps with the one I have OR swap what I have, put in an amp rack and go with two SD800s. First world problems for sure.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
I think I’m getting closer to clarity, and maybe a decision. I have two designs rattling around in my head. One consists of adding two Diamond Audio amps to my existing Micro84u (as Henry suggested), the other replaces my DA 84u with SD amps.

With the Diamond Audio amps I think it looks like this:
410704

410705

NOTE: Not a real photo... I overlaid two images here.

I could do it all at once, or I could start with an HXM800 to drive the 6.5s and use my Micro84u for the 6x9s and horns and add the 8’s, second DSR and Micro4v2 at any point later.

If I go with SD amps, I think it looks more like this:
410706



Though I may be making up the need for the second DSR and SD250.2, but unless I change one or both sets of the 6.5s so they are the same and operate on the same frequency spectrum (like four PRV Neos or something) I don’t know that I want to mix speaker sets across channels. I like the idea of them being separate for tuning, but maybe that’s just oversimplifying so I can wrap my little brain around it.

I’m a little less clear on the SD setup and how I would start by separating the 6.5s, 6x9s and horns then add the 8s at some point later, but I would definitely need the XEL amp rack for the SDs.

Let me know if I have something wrong here.
 

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BJ, my thought on this is plan for the future. What gives you more options amp wise to change things up so you don't have to "Re-power" again.

As for the 4 6x9s, not on your bike. On another bike that didn't have a custom paint, factory paint, sure. I think the dual 6x9 would take away from the paint job. Just my personal opinion.

Here is just another idea. 8s or 10s in the bag, 6.5 in the lids, compression drivers and the 6.5s up front. That could help the situation or make it more complicated!

If money wasn't a issue, SD amps all day.
Plan to leave some head room for the future.
 

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Alex said that if I go down to Miami for a weekend he would tune it for me. First world problems for sure.
If you decide to come down, let me know.

If you do the 8's in the bags, you can mount them towards the back of the bag. still giving you the room.
I've battled in my mind the 8 vs 10. for now its 10's.
 

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Here is just another idea. 8s or 10s in the bag, 6.5 in the lids, compression drivers .... That could help the situation or make it more complicated!
Now you got me thinking about going ahead and getting lids and doing compression drivers in them with the 10 in the bag.....ARrrrrrgh...I knew I should've bypassed this thread. LoL . But I'll run it by Henry to see what he has to say.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
As for the 4 6x9s, not on your bike. On another bike that didn't have a custom paint, factory paint, sure. I think the dual 6x9 would take away from the paint job. Just my personal opinion.
I think you are right. I’ve been looking at pictures, and I just don’t think I could do the dual 6x9 lids on my RGS.

And, you’re right about future proofing. That’s what I’m trying to do with all the options I’m weighing. My latest thought though is that I could add two Micro4v2 amps; use the Dirty Bird fairing pods to add 8”s and horns to the fairing; and run two more 8”s in the bags. That would allow me to use the Micro84u to run the four horns on 2 channels and the 6x9s on the other two. I’m not sure that future proofs as much as does it all ”Big Bang”, but I could do the fairing 8”s and horns first and hold on bag 8”s and a third amp for a future phase.

Two 8”s in the upper vs four 6.5“s in upper and lower might be a little less sound, but should produce more bass, and I would think that the horns will help. It also opens up options for me to add the Harley fairing spoiler that came on the 2019 CVOs and that crazy4Ink has which might be just another differentiator in how the bike looks.

410712


I think I could do the same thing with SD800s. I’m not as sure about how they would be wired, but I think it would look like this:
410713
 

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Again with your bike and that paint job, the 8s in fairing would take away from it, just my opinion.

I haven't heard the 8s in the fairing so I can't comment on the sound. But what The Da Funk shop does with 6.5 why bother? If you want stupid loud, super SQ, or both, they can get you there with 6.5 in the fairing.

SD amps 8s or 10s in the bags if you want that, and drive that gorgeous bike down to miami and let Alex work his magic.
Just like a built up motor you can have top of the line parts, but if they don't work together well and the tune is off you have a crapping running bike. Same deal with this stuff. Henry said you have the parts after you add more power you are there. Tune the hell out of it and you will be good for at least a month!! HA

There was a guy last year or the year before that drove from Pennsylvania to Miami and back on a long weekend to get a tune. Thats a long dam way but what he got was his system tuned to perfection.
 

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Discussion Starter #30
Again with your bike and that paint job, the 8s in fairing would take away from it, just my opinion.

I haven't heard the 8s in the fairing so I can't comment on the sound. But what The Da Funk shop does with 6.5 why bother? If you want stupid loud, super SQ, or both, they can get you there with 6.5 in the fairing.

SD amps 8s or 10s in the bags if you want that, and drive that gorgeous bike down to miami and let Alex work his magic.
Just like a built up motor you can have top of the line parts, but if they don't work together well and the tune is off you have a crapping running bike. Same deal with this stuff. Henry said you have the parts after you add more power you are there. Tune the hell out of it and you will be good for at least a month!! HA

There was a guy last year or the year before that drove from Pennsylvania to Miami and back on a long weekend to get a tune. Thats a long dam way but what he got was his system tuned to perfection.
You make a lot of sense here phillyfan1! Putting an HXM800.4 in for the four 6.5”s and using the micro84u for the horns and 6x9s should be a solid setup and I already have most of it.

The 8”s in the fairing seems to appeal to me more than most, and it comes with a start-over price tag. not sure why I’m overthinking this so much but I clearly am.
 

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Its a lot of work, time and money that's why you are thinking it thru. Cant just throw stuff at it and hope for the best. How you are doing this is the best way. Talk to the guys that do it everyday, not me obviously. Tell them what you want and they help you get there.
Just make sure you are dam happy with the Hertz speakers in those locations. Thats basically what you are building off of.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Its a lot of work, time and money that's why you are thinking it thru. Cant just throw stuff at it and hope for the best. How you are doing this is the best way. Talk to the guys that do it everyday, not me obviously. Tell them what you want and they help you get there.
Just make sure you are dam happy with the Hertz speakers in those locations. Thats basically what you are building off of.
The biggest problem is that I have no point of reference, other than the package setups I’ve run in the past. I clearly didn’t have something right, or the passive crossovers were impacting or having everything wired to one amp was clearly less than ideal, because I’ve been playing with each of the sets of speakers and when on their own channel they can get to sound MUCH louder and cleared than they were. The MPKs can get a well rounded sound, but aren’t as loud as the SVs. The SVs can get really loud but can’t get much bass at all. I’ve seen glimpses of solid performance from the Unity69s but they are still not dialed in running on the same channels as the ST25 (I haven’t separated them yet).

That said, if I had heard some PRV, Ground Zero, Faital or other speakers it might give me a better point of reference. And, I’m drawn to the notion of 8”s either in the fairing or in the bags to add bass, but assume that whatever bass they produce will be gone the moment I start the bike, and certainly it’’ll be in the wind on the highway.

I’m SO TIRED of being uncertain - LOL. I’m a VERY decisive person that collects data and facts then makes a decision and goes with it. I’ll figure it out, but I’m exhausted from thinking about what to do. I may just have to throw another Micro8 in the fairing, separate everything to their own channels and ride it like Henry said. Then spend some time places where I can hear what different speakers and setups sound like.
 

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Have you seen the video thread on the other forum? Mike U's bike is on there and he posted a video of my bike, post 419 and 420. It was in the garage so volume is not turned up at all, it was echoing in the garage and didn't sound right in the video. For a lid speaker they hit pretty good, for what they are.

Put some ear buds in and listen to some of those bikes. Mike U's bike is smooth and clean
 

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Discussion Starter #34
Have you seen the video thread on the other forum? Mike U's bike is on there and he posted a video of my bike, post 419 and 420. It was in the garage so volume is not turned up at all, it was echoing in the garage and didn't sound right in the video. For a lid speaker they hit pretty good, for what they are.

Put some ear buds in and listen to some of those bikes. Mike U's bike is smooth and clean
Sorry for the dumb question, but I’m not sure how to find posts 419 and 420?
 

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Sorry for the dumb question, but I’m not sure how to find posts 419 and 420?
BJ just go to the last page of "The Vid Thread" it will bring You to page 421 you will see the page # on the upper right corner and scroll from there.
Mike U.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
BJ just go to the last page of "The Vid Thread" it will bring You to page 421 you will see the page # on the upper right corner and scroll from there.
Mike U.
Thanks Mike U and @phillyfan1!

Those do sound very good!

I was actually just reviewing some Ground Zero speaker specs... what do you think of this setup:
  • XEL amp rack
  • Two SD800 amps
  • Replace MPKs and SVs in the Uppers and Lowers with four Ground Zero Black Basket 6.5”s = Channels 1 & 2
  • Add MO75T horns and grills to uppers (if they will clear the speakers) = Channels 3 & 4
  • Re-use the Unity69s and ST25s on separate channels since I already have them in the lids OR replace them with Ground Zero 7x10s = Channels 5 & 6
  • May be overkill with the 7x10s, but maybe also put two Ground Zero Yellow Basket 8”s in the bottom rear of my saddlebags = Channels 7 & 8
If I don‘t add the GZ Yellow basket 8”s to the bags the four 6.5s could be run off separate channels
 

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Hey Blue,
800.4 might be underpowering your gear. If you're going all in, you'd much rather have some room to spare on the top end rather than pushing those 800s to the max. You're talking about excess heat to the amps and as we cram multiple amps into a small space, heat kills. I'm not a fan of the black baskets for two reasons--I hate that aluminum dome that sits in the middle. The cone moves around that dome which means if you're stuck in the rain water is for sure entering the motor of that speaker. Sure you can put waterproof grill cloth over them, etc but at the end of the day, it's not like a traditional speaker with a dust cap, water will get in. Second, they need to be crossed over up around 250Hz to really take the power you should be giving them which means that warmth and punch that we all seek will be absent. This matters specifically because if you're running 8s in the back of the bags, you simply won't have that strong low end between 90 and 250 near enough to your ear to really produce a full sound at speed. It'll sound good parked though! Any speaker in the lid of your saddlebag when you're running lots of power to a woofer, even an 8, will fight for airspace. What are you attempting to capture with the lids that you aren't getting from the 8 --- OR what are you trying to capture with the 8 that you aren't getting from the lids. Think about it. The best decision I ever made was to pull the VO 6x9s from the lids, pull the 8s from the bags, replace with 10s in the bags and compression drivers in the lid. The volume from that compression driver is accurate, clear, crisp and requires next to no power. Find the right driver for that location can yield you 2500Hz to 20K and with a midbass in the bag playing 60 to 1200, your fairing and lowers running from 125Hz (or 250 with black baskets) up to 9K, you'll have your full frequency covered mostly from in front of you and you WILL hear those compression horns going down the road and they make all the difference in the world. Your plan isn't bad brother, I ran 8s and 6x9s for a long while but consider how you tune those lid speakers-- where are you missing frequencies? Consider that you could accomplish the same end or even better with a horn and a closed back 6.5 in that lid location. Metra makes an adaptor that bolts right up to a 6x9 opening and seats a 6.5 and tweeter. if you have the amp channels to run it, it's a consideration. Don't stress about it, we aren't signing anything in blood and everything is changeable. I have enough amps and speakers on shelf right now to do 2 absolutely killer bikes and 2 more daily riders. It's always changing and evolving. Remember, this isn't supposed to be stressful, it's all in good fun!
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Hey Blue,
800.4 might be underpowering your gear. If you're going all in, you'd much rather have some room to spare on the top end rather than pushing those 800s to the max. You're talking about excess heat to the amps and as we cram multiple amps into a small space, heat kills. I'm not a fan of the black baskets for two reasons--I hate that aluminum dome that sits in the middle. The cone moves around that dome which means if you're stuck in the rain water is for sure entering the motor of that speaker. Sure you can put waterproof grill cloth over them, etc but at the end of the day, it's not like a traditional speaker with a dust cap, water will get in. Second, they need to be crossed over up around 250Hz to really take the power you should be giving them which means that warmth and punch that we all seek will be absent. This matters specifically because if you're running 8s in the back of the bags, you simply won't have that strong low end between 90 and 250 near enough to your ear to really produce a full sound at speed. It'll sound good parked though! Any speaker in the lid of your saddlebag when you're running lots of power to a woofer, even an 8, will fight for airspace. What are you attempting to capture with the lids that you aren't getting from the 8 --- OR what are you trying to capture with the 8 that you aren't getting from the lids. Think about it. The best decision I ever made was to pull the VO 6x9s from the lids, pull the 8s from the bags, replace with 10s in the bags and compression drivers in the lid. The volume from that compression driver is accurate, clear, crisp and requires next to no power. Find the right driver for that location can yield you 2500Hz to 20K and with a midbass in the bag playing 60 to 1200, your fairing and lowers running from 125Hz (or 250 with black baskets) up to 9K, you'll have your full frequency covered mostly from in front of you and you WILL hear those compression horns going down the road and they make all the difference in the world. Your plan isn't bad brother, I ran 8s and 6x9s for a long while but consider how you tune those lid speakers-- where are you missing frequencies? Consider that you could accomplish the same end or even better with a horn and a closed back 6.5 in that lid location. Metra makes an adaptor that bolts right up to a 6x9 opening and seats a 6.5 and tweeter. if you have the amp channels to run it, it's a consideration. Don't stress about it, we aren't signing anything in blood and everything is changeable. I have enough amps and speakers on shelf right now to do 2 absolutely killer bikes and 2 more daily riders. It's always changing and evolving. Remember, this isn't supposed to be stressful, it's all in good fun!
Thanks cpbedor! I think it’s stressing me because I don’t know my @$$ from my belly button on a lot of this, but it is fun learning about all of it, and considering all the possibilities. And it‘s definitely cool discussing it with all of you.
 

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I have a closet full of "lessons". Slow down, plan well, more isn't always better. Try to figure out your endgame. What are you trying to accomplish? Is it a daily rider? What music? Do you ride city vs highway? Space needs for long trips? Audio is like horsepower. Once you've got it, you'll always search for more and better and it'll get expensive to get that last bit of perfection. What's good enough? For lots of dudes, 4 speakers and an amp is plenty. Are you looking for perfect sound quality or for something that will rip your face off at 110mph? Above all, how are you going to tune it all? if you're adding all that stuff, how comfortable are you in setting crossovers, adjusting Qs, boosting and cutting, choosing the right entry and exit bandpass slopes...is the DSR1 capable of doing that (actually I don't know, I've never used the DSR1) Lots of questions you need to answer before you start collecting equipment. If you don't know what an amazing bike sounds like, wait til spring, hit a bike night and go listen to a few. You'll get to wherever you want to be but pump the brakes and set some parameters...starting perhaps with a budget lol.
 

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BJ you can also get on YouTube and watch some Da Funk Shop videos of bikes Henry / Alex have done.
 
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