Road Glide banner

41 - 60 of 70 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #41
BJ you can also get on YouTube and watch some Da Funk Shop videos of bikes Henry / Alex have done.
I have been watching videos, scanning facebook, looking at google images, reading every forum I can find... tons of information out there. I think it really may be a case of analysis paralysis.

Henry gave me very practical advice when I talked to him. He said that if it was his bike he’d just put another micro8 in the fairing with the six speakers I have, then if I decide I want a little more from the 6.5s change them to PRV Neos (didn’t specify which exactly), and if I wanted more after that, a set of PRV 8”s in the bags (Didn’t specify which though).

I’m such a nut job though that that got me thinking, why not just go big right now while it’s already apart and then it’ll be a beast of a system to enjoy all spring and summer. Which led to, I know that you can put two or three diamond amps in the fairing, but the XEL would give way more room; which led to two SD800s is better than two Diamond 6x0s and my current 6.5s can handle more than 90 watts each... you can see how my head connects these dots.

It‘s all good. Starting to feel more comfortable and less overwhelmed to be able to have fun with this as a process.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,859 Posts
^^^^ You are going to have a great system. I hope you have a great set of ear plugs, lol. ^^^^
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,324 Posts
BJ... I know you're feeling about overwhelmed. I went thru it, to where I'd wake up at night thinking about what to do. I finally broke down and called Henry. Told him what I was looking for, then his suggestions. After that I was fine. Now to get my bike back and get all the parts I've ordered on it and take it to Miami.

...but now I'm thinking about adding speaker lids for a compression driver. :eek:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #44
BJ... I know you're feeling about overwhelmed. I went thru it, to where I'd wake up at night thinking about what to do. I finally broke down and called Henry. Told him what I was looking for, then his suggestions. After that I was fine. Now to get my bike back and get all the parts I've ordered on it and take it to Miami.

...but now I'm thinking about adding speaker lids for a compression driver. :eek:
Ha ha - chase that unicorn my friend!

Hopefully I‘ll have mine wrapped up by time yours is.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #45 (Edited)
EDITED - I described it incorrectly first.

I think I’m over myself and going to slightly bastardize what Henry told me to do to future proof a little. Instead of just adding another Diamond Micro8 and separating my speakers to individual channels, I think I’m going to pull the Micro84u out and buy:
  • XEL amp rack
  • SD800.4-4
  • SD800.4-2
  • MO75T tweeters for upper grills
Chris Lowe at Garage Bagger Stereo said to make one of the amps the 2 ohm SD800.4–2 and bridge the SVs off of channels 1 & 2 to deliver more power to them. That means the two amps would be allocated like:

SD800.4-2ohm
  • Channels 1 & 2 bridged to SVs (4ohm)
  • Channels 3 & 4 to Unity 69s (2ohm)
SD800.4-4ohm
  • Channels 1 & 2 to MPKs
  • Channels 3 & 4 to ST25s & MO75Ts in Parallel
My only remaining point of confusion is the wiring to bridge to the SVs. With my (limited) understanding of bridging, (Start edit) I’ll have the + wire from both speakers connected on channel 1 + and the - wire from both speaker connected on - channel 2 (End edit). If that is correct the specs for the SD800.4-2 show Bridge Power @ 12.6V @ 4Ω: 2 x 220 W RMS. If I understand correctly, that is essentially sending 440 Watts down the two wires off the amp then splitting 220 Watts to each speaker. Is that correct?

Edited pic
410740
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,495 Posts
Are you talking about running them in parallel and bridged?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #47
Are you talking about running them in parallel and bridged?
No, he said that I’d bridge the SVs to get more power to them. I think I understand that better now that both speakers are fully wired to the amp. Left and right speaker + wired to bridged amp + and left and right speaker - wired to bridged amp -

evidently that then delivers 220W to each SV speaker.
Then the 2ohm 6x9s are wired individually to channels 3&4 and 110W each.

The reason for my question is that I want to make sure the SVs get 220W each.

The SDs are probably the perfect power fit. If I bridge my Micro84u it hits 300W x 2 but un-bridged only hits 80W x 4. The HXM800 is 120W x 4 and 400W x 2 bridged. If it wouldn’t be too bad to push 300W x 2 to the SVs I’d just bridge my Micro84u to the SVs or get two SD800.4-4 amps to have more power than I needed and just dial everything back.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
BJ the way you explained it in post #45 you are Bridging and Paralleling two speakers to two channels. Positives from Two Speakers to Positive of Channel One leaving the Negative Free Then Negatives from Two Speakers to Negative of Channel 2 leaving the Positive Free. In order to do bridging alone with two speakers you would need to use four channels. Speaker One Positive to Channel One Positive. Speaker 1 Negative to Channel 2 Negative. Speaker 2 Positive to Channel 3 Positive and Speaker 2 Negative to Channel 4 Negative for True Bridging.
Also when Bridging an Amplifier You will loose Stereo.
I hope this helps.
Mike U.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #49
BJ the way you explained it in post #45 you are Bridging and Paralleling two speakers to two channels. Positives from Two Speakers to Positive of Channel One leaving the Negative Free Then Negatives from Two Speakers to Negative of Channel 2 leaving the Positive Free. In order to do bridging alone with two speakers you would need to use four channels. Speaker One Positive to Channel One Positive. Speaker 1 Negative to Channel 2 Negative. Speaker 2 Positive to Channel 3 Positive and Speaker 2 Negative to Channel 4 Negative for True Bridging.
Also when Bridging an Amplifier You will loose Stereo.
I hope this helps.
Mike U.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It did help Mike, thanks! I edited the post and pic in that post so as to make sure that it doesn’t confuse or ill inform anyone else.

That said, would you advise doing it that way (using a SD800.4-2ohm and bridging a mono sound to the SVs in the lowers), OR would you:
A) Just get two SD800.4-4s and run the SVs In the lowers at the 110W x 4 (stereo)
B) Go ahead and bridge to the SVs (mono) but use a SD800.4-4 with more power to future proof the amp setup (400W x 2 to the SVs), and just use tuning to prevent overpowering the speakers.

If it’s advisable to use two SD800.4-4s, I’m going to pre-order the EvoX versions instead of the bigger Evo versions, but they aren’t making an SD800.4-2 EvoX according to Chris. The SD800.4-4 is reported to be pushing ~130W x 4 @4 ohms which is a little more than the MPKs need and a little less than the SVs can use but is WAY more than they have been getting the way the AHB team had me set it up before when “it was fine”. So I have to assume that 130W (or even 110W) per speaker is going to make a HUGE improvement.

The other option, of course, would be to just add a Micro4v2 or HXM800.4 with the Micro84u I already have and run them. Then there’s no need for the LEX amp rack, though I might use it anyway just to make more room. Its still leaves the speakers a little underpowered up it’s becoming clear that there is no perfect match of amp providing exactly the power a speaker can handle in stereo or mono mode.

I guess the root of the question is, is it better to get real close to matching the power needs of the speakers (and in this case in mono mode)? OR, is it better to leave the speakers a little underpowered in full stereo mode? OR is it better to have the amp pushing more power than the speaker is rated for in mono mode?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,495 Posts
You always want some headroom on the amp for sure. Never want to max out your amps if you don't need to.
A lot of guys run speakers in mono and some in stereo. As for what's better, location of the speaker, type of speaker, what the rest of the system consists of and how its tuned all play a part.


When designing elaborate systems like this, the guys that do it for a living know the best, and that's not me! The wiring strategies play a huge part in the system that's why its so important to lay out a plan like you are doing. "Over build" it power wise and you will be fine. As for mono vs stereo, get Henry back on the phone
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #51
You always want some headroom on the amp for sure. Never want to max out your amps if you don't need to.
A lot of guys run speakers in mono and some in stereo. As for what's better, location of the speaker, type of speaker, what the rest of the system consists of and how its tuned all play a part.


When designing elaborate systems like this, the guys that do it for a living know the best, and that's not me! The wiring strategies play a huge part in the system that's why its so important to lay out a plan like you are doing. "Over build" it power wise and you will be fine. As for mono vs stereo, get Henry back on the phone
Thanks phillyfan1!

I think I’m leaning toward pre-ordering a 800.4 evo x and a 1200.4 Evo x, or maybe just grabbing two 1200.4 evo x and having room to grow. They will both fit on a Lex rack either way to fit in the fairing, and give me flexibility to go bigger if I want later.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
513 Posts
Thanks phillyfan1!

I think I’m leaning toward pre-ordering a 800.4 evo x and a 1200.4 Evo x, or maybe just grabbing two 1200.4 evo x and having room to grow. They will both fit on a Lex rack either way to fit in the fairing, and give me flexibility to go bigger if I want later.
I love how you are already planning on going even BIGGER. lol.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #53
I love how you are already planning on going even BIGGER. lol.
LOL - It’s beyond crazy to me to fathom 1600W, 2000W or 2400W of amplification in a motorcycle, but there are a bunch of 150W-200W+ speakers out there. I would LOVE to have more clear sound capacity on my Harley than I could use after all of these years of hitting that throttle up with my thumb only to discover that there isn’t any more there.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
It did help Mike, thanks! I edited the post and pic in that post so as to make sure that it doesn’t confuse or ill inform anyone else.

That said, would you advise doing it that way (using a SD800.4-2ohm and bridging a mono sound to the SVs in the lowers), OR would you:
A) Just get two SD800.4-4s and run the SVs In the lowers at the 110W x 4 (stereo)
B) Go ahead and bridge to the SVs (mono) but use a SD800.4-4 with more power to future proof the amp setup (400W x 2 to the SVs), and just use tuning to prevent overpowering the speakers.

If it’s advisable to use two SD800.4-4s, I’m going to pre-order the EvoX versions instead of the bigger Evo versions, but they aren’t making an SD800.4-2 EvoX according to Chris. The SD800.4-4 is reported to be pushing ~130W x 4 @4 ohms which is a little more than the MPKs need and a little less than the SVs can use but is WAY more than they have been getting the way the AHB team had me set it up before when “it was fine”. So I have to assume that 130W (or even 110W) per speaker is going to make a HUGE improvement.

You're welcome Brother.
My understanding is when using all 4-ohm speakers it's better to power them with a 2-ohm amp.
I am by no means an Audio Guru I just enjoy playing around with the stereo equipment.
I would check with the more knowledgeable audio guys on the Other Forum's Audio Section.
They will definitely steer You in the right direction as to which amps work best in Your System.
Best of Luck Bro!
MIke U.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,495 Posts
You are right BJ, Bike audio is crazy! 5-6yrs ago when I started I was messaging Gannicus and Alex about just a simple 2 speaker system. Ended up being kappas and a B2 amp. The "Big" guys were running 2 amps, lids, lowers, tour pack. The Hertz amp was the big time amp and the arc amp.
Now, its PA speakers, mids in the bags, DSPs. Would would have thought a DSP in a bike 5 yrs ago, on a bike that is driven I mean.
Its kind of like the engine world. Guys build race motors, new porting ideas, and it filters down to use. Really cool stuff for sure
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #56
Here’s the plan I just posted on the other forum for Haze and co to provide feedback on. Would love feedback from you guys too.
  • GTS Head Unit
  • DSR1 (reuse)
  • Lex Rivera amp rack (new) to fit both amps in the fairing
  • SD1200.4-4 Evo X (new)
  • SD1200.4-4 Evo X (new)
  • MO75T horns in grills (new)
  • Hertz MPK 165s in Upper fairing (reuse w/out passive crossover or tweeters)
  • Hertz SV 165s in lowers (reuse)
  • Ground Zero 7x10 in lids (replacing Unity69 and Hertz ST25s to get more bass)
  • 8” Ground Zero Yellow Basket in each saddlebag
SD1200.4-4
  • MPK 165s & MO75T horns = channels 1 & 2 (HP; 24dB; 100Hz) - Ideally, I’d have the MO75Ts on separate channels, but I am trying to avoid the complexity of two DSRs
  • SV 165s = channels 3 & 4 (HP; 24dB; 120Hz)
SD1200.4-4
  • Ground Zero 7x10 = channels 1 & 2 (HP; 24dB; 35Hz)
  • Ground Zero 8” Yellow Baskets = channels 3 & 4 (LP; 24dB; 50Hz)
I could probably power it all with SD800.4-4 Evo X amps (assume I’d have to bridge the 7x10s and 8”s that way) but I thought that going with the 1200s I future proof a bit, but if it’s too much let me know.

If you think any component should be reconsidered I’m happy to hear suggestions. Thank you all for your help as I continue to get less and less ignorant.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,495 Posts
Great plan. Deals like this come down with everything playing well together. I don't have experience or the know how to say. But,,, those guys do.
I have the 7x10s and like them compared to the pioneers that were in before. The pioneers were the best bang for the buck until the MMats. They get loud! which is great on the hwy, but could be a little harsh. the GZs have much more low end to them. How they would play with the 8s and the rest of your set up, no idea. Dam I love threads like this!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
BJ, the only problem I see that may occur with the setup You listed is the GZ 7x10's in the Lids fighting with the GZ 8's in the Bags for "Air Space".
At the least, You are going to have to put some type of "Baffle" on the 7x10's to help with it.
Mike U.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
344 Posts
Discussion Starter #59
BJ, the only problem I see that may occur with the setup You listed is the GZ 7x10's in the Lids fighting with the GZ 8's in the Bags for "Air Space".
At the least, You are going to have to put some type of "Baffle" on the 7x10's to help with it.
Mike U.
There I was getting all proud of myself for thinking maybe I’d started to figure out amp power distribution and speaker frequency balance from different locations, and now I’ve got to learn about “air space“ too?! F’ it... I’m going back to a softail and ear buds - LOL
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
513 Posts
There I was getting all proud of myself for thinking maybe I’d started to figure out amp power distribution and speaker frequency balance from different locations, and now I’ve got to learn about “air space“ too?! F’ it... I’m going back to a softail and ear buds - LOL
The sound of wind in your face and exhaust at the back of the ears has worked for over a hundred years. My 'system' is nothing in comparison to yours, let alone what yours will become, yet my little stereo makes loud enough noise for when I need or want it (it has pedestrians jumping).

Nonetheless, I am very much intrigued with your thoroughness and interest - that is the heart of the rider. I'll keep reading now.
 
41 - 60 of 70 Posts
Top