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2) Baker Drivetrain has another fix. They redesigned the hydraulic side cover that goes on the right side of the trans. This fix may have identified and addressed the "root cause".


Can you elaborate some more about this?
 

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I am certainly no mechanic and I will preface this by saying I don't have a clue how many oz are needed to properly lubricate our components. The video that I've watched numerous times on YouTube brings a lot of questions to the table. The tech clearly states that 5 oz gained/lost, really doesn't affect your engine in any way. So, for those of you that have checked your levels, were there any problems? I hear a lot of noise from guys saying they checked their levels and are just super pissed that transfer has occurred..... but I haven't heard any of those posts follow up with "I had a catastrophic failure of my engine" or "I felt like my motor was acting strange, so I drained my oil and found x,y,z".

Again, I'm not minimizing the issue here, but other than a small amount of oil being transferred, I don't see any component failures and we have a lot of bikes around here that have more than enough miles on them to really vet out if issues will occur.

It also appears that a fix is already being brought around by other companies?

https://www.fuelmotousa.com/i-23897441-ss-cycle-oil-pump-and-cam-plate-kit-for-2017-18-m8-oil-cooled-models.html#!model=TOURING ROAD GLIDE SPECIAL FLTRXS||make=HARLEY-DAVIDSON||year=2018
I guess I can say I believe it is a major issue, and the transfer can be serious as the fluid lost out of one compartment builds up in another, my engine was replaced - and no it was not only the transfer - but the amount they found in the primary was of "high" concern - HD knows there is a problem - In reality am I pissed, no, of course not, not for me, what the hell, they replaced the engine under warranty - but I ride mine, I put on miles, with the extended warranty if it happens again they will replace it again - what happens to those that do not put on miles, and it happens in three rather than two years? HD needS to address this issue openly - costly yes but customers should not have to pay the price - dealers are starting to see a lot of these - while mine was in there were three other ones on the lifts with engine issues - two were waiting for reviews - If you have one with what you think is an issue stay on top of it - check the fluids - check the codes - if there is an issue report it - it does not get better - document what you lost on the worksheet and have them acknowledge it - "customer reported transmission was low -- onces" - "Customer reported engine light on" etc.- no one wants to be an asshole but you should not be forced to pay for a mistake you did not cause, you bought in good faith - just document the issues and if it needs repair have it done the right way and settle for nothing less.
 

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From what I've read, yes.... YOU have a major concern because you've had a stage 4 completed- and the youtube videos from the post acknowledge that they have a KNOWN issue with the stage 4 builds.

For the guys that are running an extra 3-5 oz. in 1000+ miles..... we all know that it's a bummer, but I haven't come across a mechanic yet or ANY members of this forum who feel that you'll do any damage to these motors at that kind of transfer rate.

As it's been said before- you cannot skip the maintenance intervals outlined and as long as you follow those and you're just generally in tune with how your motor sounds and acts, you won't have any issues.

Its crazy to request the MotorCo recall motors or replace every motor because of these issues. Anyone who knows the system, knows they are not going to spend millions to recall motors for something that happens to a small majority- it just seems to be a larger percentage because everyone comes to this great place to voice concerns. The MotorCo's stance is right in line with every major manufacture I've ever come across- you have a 2 year warranty...... use it and we will repair/replace any component under warranty that is found to be defective or have issues. They aren't going to assume the liability to replace everything when it's not needed. It sucks.... but it's no different than ANY other major manufacture.
 

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Glad to hear the M8 is treating you and others very well. Myself and others will just sit here on the sidelines for a while longer.
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Think back to ever major engine release HD has ever had.....they all have and all had issues that only erred their head in some cases....others, not so much.

IMHO, much a do about nothing - The Motor is great and runs much better than all my old TCs
 

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Easy for you to say since your bike doesn’t do it. My new 2018 RGS does it. Pisses me off. No one should try to justify this B.S. Absolutely unacceptable for a 30,000 dollar machine migrating even an ounce of fluid.
Pete
 

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Relatively speaking, old bikes back in the day were damn expensive as well. And those bikes had issues. Some were serious. I don’t bitch and complain about any of my old bikes to include the AMF bowling ball bikes I’ve had. Literally it was about an hour of wrenching for every two hours of rinding. Sometimes less. Now we are talking oranges to apples here, I get it. But let’s sit back and really look at it. Do we know HD isn’t going to fix these bikes? No. Is it a wide spread issue? No. Is it a fatal flaw like a timing chain? No. Is the bike going to crash? No. Is the bike going to lose all value overnight? Nah.

Crack open a cold beer and relax. Tomorrow, go ride your M8 and smile. Enjoy life. It’s too damn short to worry about something so minor in the grand scheme of things.
 

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Discussion Starter #87
Easy for you to say since your bike doesn’t do it. My new 2018 RGS does it. Pisses me off. No one should try to justify this B.S. Absolutely unacceptable for a 30,000 dollar machine migrating even an ounce of fluid.
Pete
I thought I had the issue because I bought one of the first M8s. The fact that 2018s are still getting shows that it wasn't fixed at least a year after production began.
 

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I thought I had the issue because I bought one of the first M8s. The fact that 2018s are still getting shows that it wasn't fixed at least a year after production began.

You have to take into consideration that the issue didn't show up as a reoccurring problem until the 2018's were most likely already being assembled or at least the parts were being manufactured. I don't know when the first threads started showing up about the problem but I'm pretty sure I never heard of the problem until the 2018's came out and I am pretty diligent about staying in the know about these bikes. I may have heard about it sooner but it wasn't much or maybe at that time it had only been a couple of bikes. I would actually find it hard to believe that the MoCo isn't working hard at resolving the issue. I could be wrong though and I know that doesn't help those of you that have the problem. Just ride it so much that you have to take it back to the dealership every other week and they will either fix it or give you a new bike. That's what I would try to do anyway.
 

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Easy for you to say since your bike doesn’t do it. My new 2018 RGS does it. Pisses me off. No one should try to justify this B.S. Absolutely unacceptable for a 30,000 dollar machine migrating even an ounce of fluid.
Pete
I am 100% on your side Pal and I am sorry you had/have to go through this.......just want to make a point that it is not happening on every M8 and should not detour anyone from exploring the option of owning one.

Who know, mine might grenade tomorrow and my attitude will reflect accordingly
 

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Easy for you to say since your bike doesn’t do it. My new 2018 RGS does it. Pisses me off. No one should try to justify this B.S. Absolutely unacceptable for a 30,000 dollar machine migrating even an ounce of fluid.
Pete
I agree 100%! I paid good money for this thing. I should not have to worry about oil transfer. I bought a brand new bike so I wouldn’t have issues.
 

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Warranty doesn't help if there's no fix. As of now there is no fix. Other forum says 2019s are coming with a vent tube as the fix. I'll believe it when I see it.
Is that vent tube on the tranny? Or elsewhere?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

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They put that "kit" in my transmission back in early April of this year. It was partially effective. In other words in slowed the migration down, but did not stop it. It amounts to a plastic plug that slips over the clutch push rod. It takes about an hour to put this one in.

I know of two other riders that had it done at the same time at my dealership and both report mixed results as well. Not a real fix, just a band-aid. Another "fix" they are trying out on some bikes is a pressure relief rubber hose that is attached to the primary case. That one is a little more involved as they have to drill a hole in the top of the primary case, tap & thread it and then attach a rubber hose to it to relieve any vacuum which has built up in the primary. The rubber hose is routed down to the ground below the frame. That fix is a little more far out for me because I believe the problem is with the transmission pushing fluid down the push rod tube, not being sucked down the tube by a vacuum in the primary. Keep in mind that these are all just half assed attempts to placate riders who are having fluid migration. I guess if they announce they have a method of slowing down the transfer that gives them the right to claim they have a fix. Since it has been 24 months now since this problem was discovered, that would indicate a flaw in the original design of the M8. Curiously the migration only appears in some M8s, not all. The common denominator is that it only presents in bikes that have hydraulic clutches, not manual clutches.
How would the tranny get pressurized? I have read a explanation of how the engine pulls a vacuum in the primary, which sucks tranny fluid into the primary. But this is the first I've seen of the other way around. How does that happen?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

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My 18 RG seems to have this issue although it's minor right now. 2k since the last fluid change and it has dropped about an 1/8 inch on the stick. Four months old and at 7k currently. I plan to just keep watching it and if it gets worse or continues have it worked on while under warranty hoping Harley comes up with a fix between now and then. Plan to mention it when I get the clutch work done.
 

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I have this problem on my 2017 RGU. In my OPINION, This transfer only happens when driving at Interstate speeds for long distances. I had a 10 oz transfer on my 23 day transcontinental trip 15 months ago. (8500 miles) Since I do all my own maintenance I will deal with it. I run 20w50 synthetic oil in both primary and tranny. I notice that when the primary gets to be 8 to 10 oz overfilled, it gets to be hard to find neutral. That tells me to change the primary and top off the tranny. You will probably not EVER have a problem with the transmission being 10 oz low because you have almost 3 inches of oil over the gearset. YMMV I would still buy an M-8 with this problem because it's still the best engine Harley Davidson has ever produced.
 

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Buzzy, how does the engine put the primary under a vacumn? I'm confused. The engine and primary are sealed were they come together. So there should be no way the engine crankcase could create a vacumn in the primary.
 

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I wonder if the ET performance crank case vent that helps in removing crank case pressure would do anything to keep the oil transfer from happening. I don't know if it affects that area of the motor, just curious.
 

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Buzzy, how does the engine put the primary under a vacumn? I'm confused. The engine and primary are sealed were they come together. So there should be no way the engine crankcase could create a vacumn in the primary.
from what i've read, in order to pacify the pencil pushers at EPA, they changed the breather route on the M8 so that it vents to the transmission. they used to vent blow-by oil mist to the air intake on carbureted engines but it is more complex when fuel injecting.

europe has a stringent set of rules about venting to atmosphere too so this is going to get interesting
 

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I had a transfer problem on my 17 M8 from the first time I bought my bike. I talked to a Harley rep. and he put a breather on the backside of the primary and ran the hose up the frame and put a turndown to keep the passageway clear. This fix my transfer problem and it will not dent my ext. warranty.
 
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