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That affected so much mare. I remember hearing about how the farmers who also exported were hit hard during this "war".

curious what he means by "reciprocate"
 

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Discussion Starter #3
That affected so much mare. I remember hearing about how the farmers who also exported were hit hard during this "war".



curious what he means by "reciprocate"
Yeah I was wondering that too. So now he seems to understand how bad the tariffs are affecting Harley.

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That affected so much mare. I remember hearing about how the farmers who also exported were hit hard during this "war".

curious what he means by "reciprocate"
Eye for an eye. Its good for American companies, but will cause prices to rise at first until they drop their tariffs . (End game)
 

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Eye for an eye. Its good for American companies, but will cause prices to rise at first until they drop their tariffs . (End game)
Hopefully they drop their tariffs if not it won't be good for the US companies.

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Sorry, I have no sympathy for a company that continues to support a CEO who's as totally inept as Levatich. He's the brainiac who engineered the purchase of MV Augusta, remember that one:

"Less than two years after buying an Italian motorcycle manufacturer for $109 million, Harley-Davidson Inc. essentially paid the previous owners to take it back. Harley recently returned MV Agusta to its Italian owners for 3 euros, or about $3.98, a company spokesman confirmed Monday. As part of the deal, Harley had to put 20 million euros, or about $26 million, into MV Agusta's coffers before selling it, according to a Securities and Exchange Commission filing documenting the sale."


Then he spent hundreds of millions designing, engineering, and manufacturing the 500/750 Street models, that were supposed to draw in a whole new segment of young riders. Another very significant financial drain as nobody bought them. Now his answer for attracting a younger generation is to offer up a $30k electric motorcycle that's twice as expensive as other electric bikes.

Here he goes again, blaming everyone but himself and his team for the problems HD faces. HD's board needs to fire his worthless ass.
 

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Hopefully they drop their tariffs if not it won't be good for the US companies.

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Its still good for the US companies because they (the forien companies) will have to raise their prices and now it's an even playing field. Though we the consumer pays more , oh well, we should of been buying American anyways.
 

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By no means an apology.

Its tit for tat negotiation. I open for a bottle of wine and some cheese, you bump with scooters. So now he want to go all in and hit those automobiles.
He's just trying to convince his base to support him. And Harley customers are a huge part of his base. Tariffs on EU scooters isn't much of a deal. But tariffs on "EU motor vehicles" will be enough to make a few Germans cry uncle.
 

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Sorry, I have no sympathy for a company that continues to support a CEO who's as totally inept as Levatich. He's the brainiac who engineered the purchase of MV Augusta, remember that one:

"Less than two years after buying an Italian motorcycle manufacturer for $109 million, Harley-Davidson Inc. essentially paid the previous owners to take it back. Harley recently returned MV Agusta to its Italian owners for 3 euros, or about $3.98, a company spokesman confirmed Monday. As part of the deal, Harley had to put 20 million euros, or about $26 million, into MV Agusta's coffers before selling it, according to a Securities and Exchange Commission filing documenting the sale."


Then he spent hundreds of millions designing, engineering, and manufacturing the 500/750 Street models, that were supposed to draw in a whole new segment of young riders. Another very significant financial drain as nobody bought them. Now his answer for attracting a younger generation is to offer up a $30k electric motorcycle that's twice as expensive as other electric bikes.

Here he goes again, blaming everyone but himself and his team for the problems HD faces. HD's board needs to fire his worthless ass.
No sympathy, I've owned 3 businesses (1 V-twin P&A/repair) I have no empathy for Harleys greedy management team.....
 

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Harley started going downhill when they required all the dealers to become boutiques .. Then everything went up ...

AMF's money allowed them to come up with the EVO ( design started while still under AMF ) , then everything went crazy ...

Beyond the initial purchase of a new bike , I spend as little as possible with the dealers ...
 

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Almost decided not to jump into the fray since the title falls just short of click bait and an attempt to piss at least 50% of us off..................

But, hell no it's not an apology. HD has been sliding down hill ever since Levatich took the helm as CEO. He might have been a great engineer, but he sucks as a CEO. Here are their revenue numbers for the last 5 years;

(millions)
2018 $5717
2017 $5647
2016 $5996
2015 $5995
2014 $6229

2019 is off to even a worse start, and I'll let you guess what year Levatich took over using the revenue numbers above to help you guess right. I'm not a fan of tariffs in general because of the short term pain caused to specific commodities, producers, manufacturers and consumers. Further complicating the issue is the unpredictable long term impact that tariffs can have on an economy. However, in order for every player (read countries) to have equal opportunities at success, the playing field has to be level. And, the fact is the playing field hasn't been level for decades. Foreign countries, their governments, their corporations and their economies have played the US as a stooge for years. I've worked in three completely different industries in my career and each and every one of them has been impacted by globalization and unfair trade practices; automotive, firearms, consumer electronics. I've watched as corporate trade secrets have been stolen, intellectual knowledge pirated, wage inequalities widened, nation state subsidies, corporate and share holder greed run rampant while multiple administrations in the US throw their hands up in the air and tell us how great a global economy is for the American worker and the American consumer.

Automotive - 3 of our US plants were closed and the work moved to plants in Mexico
Firearms - approximately 73% of our US workforce was eliminated when production operations moved to China, Brazil and Turkey
Consumer Electronics - turned into disposable commodities when manufacturing moved from the U.S., Japan and into China

The Germans and most of the EU have leveraged our own policies and trade practices against us
The Chinese are without a doubt the worst

So while the Trump administrations tariffs, economic policies and general approach to world trade may turn into a complete nuclear meltdown, I still think it's better than sitting on our hands and being content with the previous status-quo.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Almost decided not to jump into the fray since the title falls just short of click bait and an attempt to piss at least 50% of us off..................

But, hell no it's not an apology. HD has been sliding down hill ever since Levatich took the helm as CEO. He might have been a great engineer, but he sucks as a CEO. Here are their revenue numbers for the last 5 years;

(millions)
2018 $5717
2017 $5647
2016 $5996
2015 $5995
2014 $6229

2019 is off to even a worse start, and I'll let you guess what year Levatich took over using the revenue numbers above to help you guess right. I'm not a fan of tariffs in general because of the short term pain caused to specific commodities, producers, manufacturers and consumers. Further complicating the issue is the unpredictable long term impact that tariffs can have on an economy. However, in order for every player (read countries) to have equal opportunities at success, the playing field has to be level. And, the fact is the playing field hasn't been level for decades. Foreign countries, their governments, their corporations and their economies have played the US as a stooge for years. I've worked in three completely different industries in my career and each and every one of them has been impacted by globalization and unfair trade practices; automotive, firearms, consumer electronics. I've watched as corporate trade secrets have been stolen, intellectual knowledge pirated, wage inequalities widened, corporate and share holder greed run rampant and multiple administrations in the US throw their hands up in the air and tell us how great a global economy is for the American worker and the American consumer.

Automotive - 3 of our US plants were closed and the work moved to plants in Mexico
Firearms - approximately 73% of our US workforce was eliminated when production operations moved to China, Brazil and Turkey
Consumer Electronics - turned into disposable commodities when manufacturing moved from the U.S., Japan and into China

The Germans and most of the EU have leveraged our own policies and trade practices against us
The Chinese are without a doubt the worst

So while the Trump administrations tariffs, economic policies and general approach to world trade may turn into a complete nuclear meltdown, I still think it's better than sitting on our hands and being content with the previous status-quo.
I apologize for the title it's not to be clickbait. The article shows he has a change of heart on Harley decision to move some production overseas. If you read his tweet he sees that Harley is only trying to get around the high tariffs of the EU.

When the group Bikers for Trump announced their boycott of Harley he supported it.




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I apologize for the title it's not to be clickbait. The article shows he has a change of heart on Harley decision to move some production overseas. If you read his tweet he sees that Harley is only trying to get around the high tariffs of the EU. When the group Bikers for Trump announced their boycott of Harley he supported it.
No worries buddy. My response wasn't intended as an attack on you as much as general frustration with Levatich and the job he has(nt) done as HD's CEO. He constantly points fingers at everyone and everything else instead of looking in the mirror, self-reflecting and then admitting that his leadership up to this point has been a monumental failure. His answer to improving the bottom line is to close US plants, move production from one facility or another, design and build with cheaper components, and offshore anything that he can't figure out how to manufacture in the US and sell profitably in a global market place. I won't even get started on pricing or dealing with the paradigm shifts in our home market as it applies to motorcycle owners and potential motorcycle owners. He follows a long line of "American" CEOs who's answers to satisfying their own greed and the greed of their shareholders is to "build it cheaper" somewhere else.

How about building a bike that younger generations are interested in buying at a reasonable price, while still serving the 40+ crowd that controls the majority of the money? Why do they think that every dealer needs a 50,000 sq. ft. building that feels like a trip to the Apple store? How about incorporating some of the best in class engineering, design and manufacturing lessons that we've learned in the last 30 years to build a better, problem free sled that more people can afford and want to own?
 

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I'll refrain from making any political comments as that will take us way too far away from the intent of the OP. "wevsspot", you and I are on the same page in terms of Levatich being Harley's main problem over the last several years. Although he wasn't the CEO at the time they chose to buy MV Augusta, he was the one who engineered the buy-out, and 'sold' management on the terms of the purchase. It was his 'baby' all the way.

HD has a very serious (I'd even say "critical") challenge ahead of it. When you look at who their customer base is now, it's easy to identify that the baby boomer generation comprises the vast majority of it. I'm one of them. Look around you. The last round of the baby boomer generation is now set to retire, and with this next retirement cycle goes the last of the customer base that's filled HD's coffers for the past 30 years. I don't know the stats, but I'd guess that the vast majority of the riding boomers will quit riding due to age issues within the next 10-12 years. That's going to create a huge sales void for HD to fill. Now add in all those used bikes that these boomers will be putting on the used bike market and add them to all of the very low mileage bikes sitting in the garages of the boomer 'wanna be bikers' who bought a bike because their friends were all riding, but soon lost interest. These bikes were shoved into a corner of their garages and draped with a blankets. The number of previously sold bikes that fit into this 'wanna be' category that are now sitting unused in garages is staggering, especially here in Florida.

Those 50,000 sq. ft. dealerships are going to become echo chambers if HD cannot create a new younger customer base pretty damned quickly. The "bagger boom" that was created primarily by the independent custom builder shops in and around Phoenix fueled the huge bagger marker that HD has been basking in for the past dozen or more years and has in itself brought quite a few younger riders into the HD dealerships. Without the bagger boom, HD would have had to lay off much of it's work force by now.

I'm hopeful that they'll find what, up to now, has been a very elusive magic formula for attracting younger riders, and I hope they find the solution before they're forced to sell out to Ford or Kia or some other car manufacturer. I believe it's going to be nearly impossible for them to attract enough young riders because the overall number of young riders has been shrinking for several years now. Virtually all of the bike manufacturers are facing the same problem - the younger generations have their noses stuck in their video games and social media and could care less about motorcycles. I've made "fool's bets" before, but I'm betting that HD will eventually be forced to move into building and selling other forms of motorized equipment in order to expand their business in a significant way. Are you old enough to remember HD golf carts? Perhaps we'll see HD branded lawn mowers, weed wackers, and gentlemen's tractors before this is all through. Seems to me that manufacturing 4 wheelers and utility ATVs would be a natural for a company like HD.

All of this 'wisdom' and I didn't even sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night! I don't profess to have all the answers, but as a 30+ year career sales/marketing manager for a couple of Fortune 500/1000 companies I've been down these paths before - mostly in the automotive aftermarket where we experienced double digit losses in the number of distributors and jobbers (parts stores) year after year. Let's hope that HD finds a solution to it's problems before it's too late. With a lame-ass CEO who should be fired for his incompetency, they're biggest asset is their "brand" and the fact that they still have huge cash reserves .... although they're going to start burning through it at an alarming rate if the current top management continues unchecked.

What's your opinion on the matter?
 

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I apologize for the title it's not to be clickbait. The article shows he has a change of heart on Harley decision to move some production overseas. If you read his tweet he sees that Harley is only trying to get around the high tariffs of the EU.

When the group Bikers for Trump announced their boycott of Harley he supported it.




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Production overseas was scheduled long before the tariffs. HD just decided to jump on the Blame President Trump Train.

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Discussion Starter #16
Production overseas was scheduled long before the tariffs. HD just decided to jump on the Blame President Trump Train.

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It's true the Thailand plant was already in the works but it was only going to be a CKD plant which builds about a 100 bikes a week for the Asian market. Now it will supply the EU markets to avoid the heavy tariffs even President Trump acknowledged that now. He even said that Harley had to move production to offset the EU tariffs. His words not mine.

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It's true the Thailand plant was already in the works but it was only going to be a CKD plant which builds about a 100 bikes a week for the Asian market. Now it will supply the EU markets to avoid the heavy tariffs even President Trump acknowledged that now. He even said that Harley had to move production to offset the EU tariffs. His words not mine.

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There's a plant in Brasil that has been making bikes for a while also.

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There's a plant in Brasil that has been making bikes for a while also.

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Yes it's a CKD plant also due to the high tariffs that Brazil has. CKD plants get their parts from the US plants. Basically it's a bike in a box. Complete bikes with painted tins are shipped unassembled to CKD plants. A CKD plant might assemble 100 bikes a week vs 500 a day at the US plants.

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What's your opinion on the matter?
Agreed. You and me are seeing the exact same problems and root cause(s) of the problems, just from different perspectives in the business world. I spent 20 years in manufacturing primarily in the engineering and quality disciplines. My last 10 years have been as a Business Development Officer and now President. I definitely know where you're coming from.
 
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