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Discussion Starter #3
That video was only 19 seconds. Do you know if they have a full version out there somewhere?
Doesn't seem to be any so far. I "googled" for more videos and found three versions - all virtually the same and each only about 20 seconds or so long.
 

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Go to HD forums long thread on it there. Also look up Fuel Moto Jamie has said he helped with it and he has it on his web site.

At a glance I think it looks awesome I wish I knew this was coming out I bought the TTS only about a month ago.

Suppose to to start selling about December I read. I have a e mail into Jamie at FM for pricing. He said to e mail for price in one of his threads on a different forum. I can see getting my self one after I get over beating my self up for the TTS I should of waited because of weather etc.

My disclaimer is all this info is what I have read on the internet in the last few hours.....
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Go to HD forums long thread on it there. Also look up Fuel Moto Jamie has said he helped with it and he has it on his web site.

At a glance I think it looks awesome I wish I knew this was coming out I bought the TTS only about a month ago.

Suppose to to start selling about December I read. I have a e mail into Jamie at FM for pricing. He said to e mail for price in one of his threads on a different forum. I can see getting my self one after I get over beating my self up for the TTS I should of waited because of weather etc.

My disclaimer is all this info is what I have read on the internet in the last few hours.....
Cool... he got his webpage done and here's the link.
 

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Such an excellent device. Can't wait to see how the a-hole HD people try to void your warranty for using it....and you know they will try.
 

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Looks like it will be very costly. Doc
I am guessing it would be about the same price as getting a TTS, PCV, SEPST and dyno tune. The device does marry to ECM so once you use it, it goes with the bike. But you can use to read your buddy's info on his bike even if you married it your bike.
 

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Such an excellent device. Can't wait to see how the a-hole HD people try to void your warranty for using it....and you know they will try.
Can you blame them? I mean seriously. When folks have the capability to manipulate things like fuel mapping/ignition timing, that could literally destroy an engine, if done wrong. I love to modify my bike, but when doing something major like this, I do so with eyes wide open, and don't expect the MOCO to bail me out(or bail out an aftermarket company), if something goes wrong, that obviously wouldn't have, had I left the bike alone. If it's that big a deal...wait for the warranty to expire. Mines up in July.....then it's cam time!

This looks like a pretty cool product....time will tell.

Jeff
 

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Such an excellent device. Can't wait to see how the a-hole HD people try to void your warranty for using it....and you know they will try.
Can not blame them for that. One nice thing about this device is that it is not a piggy back and it saves your original map so if you have problems just reflash the original map back and they will not know it was ever messed with.
 

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Greetings, just joined in the forum, there is some info on other boards from Jamie,
Pricing is Power Vision MSRP is $549.00 and the AT-100 MSRP is $369.00

So the $499 is just the Power Vision, if you want auto tune assistance it just about doubles it. Looks like a good unit and I like the video screen, I too have TTS and I bought a 7 inch monitor and fitted a RAM mount to it so I can connect to the laptop and tune... I understand TTS is about to release some new things.

Looks better for us home tuners on the EFI bikes....
 

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You only need the AT100 if you want to use wideband autotuning. The powervision comes with an autotune program that uses the stock o2 sensors. I was quoted $499 for the power vision and $299 for the AT100.
 

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That is the information posted by Jamie himself on HTT....

No you don't have to have the AT but if you want it
that is the expense....

There is a lot that has not been revealed about the unit
so I would wait until you find 10 to 100 users on the net
telling you what the shortcomings are, they all have them
SESPT, SERT, PC5,TTS everyone of them is simply a tool
that allows you to make changes to the tune.

The proof will be in the pudding as they say, it will
still require tuning knowledge and skills without the AT, and
99% of the people putting this stuff on have no idea
what they are doing when it comes to getting a proper tune
and they would be best served by having the AT..
 

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The unit comes with a basic autotune function that utilizes the stock o2 sensors Jamie told me this when I asked him about the unit not to mention it states it on their website.

"Power Vision also includes comprehensive tuning software for your computer including an integrated tuning utility called Auto Tune Basic which uses the stock narrowband sensors, and there is an awesome option the Auto Tune Pro which uses the AT-100 with dual Bosch Wideband sensors. "

You need zero tuning knowledge for this device it's much like a TV3, the new cobra unit and a few others that offer auto tuning with the stock o2 sensors. It's nice that it offers an upgrade to wideband for those who may have minimal mods now but plan on going big and swapping out the throttle body and injectors. As much as I am intrigued by this unit I will still be going with a TMax. I think it fits my overall goals better and I like the fact it's a complete ECM swap.
 

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Guess I'm just not in favor of telling people you need zero knowledge because
the possibility exists that someone will get this and make a change that can hurt a bike
screwing around with timing tables, fuel, or any number of tables.

This provides the user access just like TTS to areas where someone could screw things
up significantly, if you don't have tuning abilities, at least understand air flow and timing
you shouldn't be in those tables. JMO, you can lunch a $5K engine.

Not saying it's not a good solution, it's just another tool, and like most tools
when put in the hands of a pro, they tend to yield better results...

You might be able to upload a map, once they get the canned maps developed
for this device that have been tested and work. However as history has proven it doesn't mean
the map won't need some tweaking based on your engine and the area of the country you live.

If the map you select was created for a bike in Daytona and you are in Denver, it's going to
be rich. The device is going to allow you to make changes to maps and ve for your
bike just like TTS and SESPT from what I can see, nice that it's mounted on the handle bars..

Let just say the intake, head and cam selection you have is creating a problem
with the sensors misreading kpa and making it impossible or difficult to get
good VE's in an area, or, you have no idea that you are uploading bad numbers
and just "trust it" might be tuned but not "properly tuned" (true story guy I know has had nightmares fixing this)

The significant number of combination of head porters, heads, cams, displacement,
compression, gearing, intake, makes it more difficult...

So you need to know enough to select the right map, load it, connect the unit
operate it as instructed, interpolate data and create a map.

I know several Tmax users, all have had to return to Tmax booth at Daytona for "updates and corrections"

Its not all plug and play in this area for anyone...
 

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Very few people will start screwing around with things they have no knowledge of on a 20k+ bike and if they do they get what's coming to them. I find most of the people that screw up their bikes with tuning are people who think they know what they are doing/have limited knowledge.

I know plenty of Tmax users one with over 30k on his bike zero problems. There is always someone that will have a problem with something and I heard the early Tmax modules had some bugs.

I never said the tune would be completely correct only that the user needs no tuning knowledge to use it. No tune is completely correct even if done by a pro. They can only tune for the conditions on the day and at the place of the tune. As soon as you drive off it changes. This is the advantage of autotune while you may not get the optimal tune for a given day or place you will be very close everywhere you go. There is no dyno tuner that can offer you that.
 

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RC wasn't trying to take a jab at you, just trying to offer a different opinion, based on my trials and tribulations with Twin Tech, Tmax, Carbs, TTS, Powercommanders, fuelers that the "auto tuners" really are nice but they are only as good as the base map they start with.

JMO of course, those people won't be the ones that buy this, The "do not touch it crowd" typically buy SE heads, pistons, intake, filters and SESPT software. They are the ones in fear of doing anything to the bike, and generally let the dealer change the oil or do any work at all, or maybe a favorite indy shop...

If they are afraid to go into the tables, then its likely they will have the same problem running the VE tune section of the PCV just like the TTS etc, fear of screwing it up. They will need to opt for auto tune and wider band sensors. (They are really not wide band sensors they are just a bit more robust, if they were wide band you'd drop several K for the unit including sensors)

Until you put that bike on a dyno there is no way you know for certain that your selection is best, it's also a tool to determine what changes do, and how they effect the performance. Butt Dynos are notoriously unreliable generally to the "high side" LOL

It will be interesting to see if the "tuning feature" of this comes in and allows you to ride, then, automatically uploads the VE figures for both cylinders without asking you to confirm it's ok...IE Review,

Consider also that the HD uses narrow band sensors on the bike, so anything outside specific kpa (pressure) generally yields unreliable data, or unrepeatable patterns... I understand it may do the mathematics for you to extrapolate outside the areas where you can hit with the bike on the road to complete ve as well as any other areas of concern such as detonation.

I presume you have used a TTS or similar to tune a bike and seen the data it obtains from the narrow HD sensors. As you are aware it won't fill 100%, or even 80% of the cells on the street, there are just RPM/TPS locations you can't hit.

Even on Tmax you can't hit 100% all the time, and unless you buy the add on Tmax auto tune you are in the same boat as this, except you have no idea what is happening as you ride. At least with the PCV you will see the information...

I run a 7 inch USB monitor on my bike when doing VE runs. Helps to hit all the areas you need when you can see the board that needs work...
 
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