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Discussion Starter #1
Soo... not too proud to admit I'm completely ignorant to all things tuning and Efi... Picked up a 15 RGS in April and have since put 17k on it including a trip to Surgis from Rhode Island and back. i don't anticipate too many more viable riding days and want to get into the bike and do some work during the off season..other than some basic audio lighting and electrical work (which i am capable of) I am planning a stage I to start which I am certain will lead to more and more work in the future..

I've already purchased the SE street cannons and the performance machine MaxHP intake... will be in the next week or so ordering the fullsac DX header....


My questions are:

What tuners are you running, what do you like/dislike?

What do you recommend for the Stage I and beyond as I'm sure that cams and more will happen as a natural progression

hopefully this all makes sense as I'm just getting out of work on a 34hr shift

thanks in advance for your time and input
 

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FP3 is an awesome tuner for stage 1, and could be a viable "beyond" tuner as it is now more adjustable than in year's past. It is also right up your alley being extremely easy to install and use. Tons of features and some of the best customer service options available. Recently came across this informative review:

https://youtu.be/pQkbnUyPIYY
 

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I have a Thunder Max, but that's because I have a lot of engine work on my 2010. I have a 2016 and I'm very seriously considering the Vance &Hines FP3, for the cost and what it does, seems to be a good unit. I'll keep reading reviews and decide in the next couple of months.
 

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I have the V&H FP3. It's easy to install, has many maps and an auto tuning feature. I like the various feedback options I can run on my iPhone as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks all for the feedback the fp3 is definitely appealing due to its simplicity but I'm leary it may not be upgradeable enough... i understand that with most of the others a dyne tune is the best option. if anyone else has anything to add please do

thanks again
 

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If you are seriously considering more engine mods down the road and you have a certain dyno guy in mind, ask him what tuner he likes to work with. In the long run you will most likely get a better end result. I myself have the TTS Mastertune and am happy with it.
 

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I've used THundermaxx, Power Commanders, etc. On my 16 I went with Direct Link, similar to TTS and had it dyno tuned after cams, etc. I couldn't be happier as it is perfect with timing and with the air/fuel ratio. Also was able to set the cruising area for fuel mileage. Average about 42 mph highway mileage running 75 mph. Good luck with your choice.
 

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Wiretie, you opened a can of worms on this one :)

Every recommendation given is probably the "right" answer depending on what you want to do down the road.

If you see yourself changing cams or any other really aggressive engine mods, it makes sense to ask your preferred tuning shop what they would want to use in the event you decide to dyno tune.

If you see yourself sticking with just a high flow intake, aftermarket slip-ons and possibly new head pipes, then the FP3 is an affordable and viable alternative.

I've got a high flow Performance Machine air intake, SE Street Cannon Slip-Ons and the FP3 was just what the doctor ordered and I've been really happy with it. Went on the bike right after the first 1,000 mile service and air intake upgrade. I'll continue using it after the new Fuelmoto 2-1-2 sport pipes go on this winter. At that point I don't see any future engine mods until I'm well past the factory warranty period.

Tuners are expensive, so I'd recommend buying the one that serves your purpose for the longest period of time.
 

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A Power Vision from Fuel Moto will also do it. Stage 1 & beyond. Free maps for life if you buy from them. Great customer service.
I ditto this comment and buy a PowerVision from Fuel Moto unless you want to replace the ECM then I would go Thundermax.
 

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Lots of good discussion on this issue. But you should understand a few things before deciding on the best tuner for you.

Perhaps the most important issue is deciding if/who will help you dial in the tuner/motor combination. If you plan on having a shop/dealer do a tune/dyno run on your bike, ask them which tuner they prefer. Then ask them why. If you can, talk to their customers to see what they thought of the shop's work. Generally, regardless of tuner used, if a bike sees more power, runs cooler, and gets close to stock mpg fuel mileage, the tune was done properly.

Tuners use different methods to perform their function:
- The PC series modifies the ECM data tables
- The TMax replaces the ECM and uses its own data
- The SE tuner modifies the ECM data tables

I'm unsure about the others, but these are the common methods to modify your timing, spark, and AFR.

Most of these tuners are good, but some have variances. The maps used in the SE tuner are configured for HD parts--cams, TB sizes, etc., so it may seem less 'user-friendly' if you're using aftermarket parts, although that isn't wholly true. Tuners with auto-tune feature are the rage these days, but if your tuning technician is good with a particular tuner, (and you trust him), go with his recommendation.

If you plan to do your own tuning, spend the time to learn the software before deciding. Again, each tuner uses a slightly different sw version and user interface, so if one ends up being easier for you to understand, go with that.

Sorry for the long answer--I learned the long way.
 

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Does adding a tuner change things enough that it is noticeable, or just makes it run a bit smoother? What I am asking, I guess is does adding this mod really change the operation enough to be obvious or subtle?
 

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Does adding a tuner change things enough that it is noticeable, or just makes it run a bit smoother? What I am asking, I guess is does adding this mod really change the operation enough to be obvious or subtle?

I'm not an engine expert, but with just changing the exhaust and air cleaner then adding a tuner, the biggest difference you'll see when your bike is tuned properly is a heat reduction. I'm not familiar with the street cannons so I don't know if they are full system catless or not. If they are, you'll definitely have less heat.


Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

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Does adding a tuner change things enough that it is noticeable, or just makes it run a bit smoother? What I am asking, I guess is does adding this mod really change the operation enough to be obvious or subtle?
I'm no expert either but I say absolutely noticeable
 

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Does adding a tuner change things enough that it is noticeable, or just makes it run a bit smoother? What I am asking, I guess is does adding this mod really change the operation enough to be obvious or subtle?
Smoother is noticeable. I ran a tuner on my stock bike (until I added the DX pipe and CVO mufflers), and the difference was staggering. Stock, these bikes are very, very good. With a tune they're even better.
 

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Does adding a tuner change things enough that it is noticeable, or just makes it run a bit smoother? What I am asking, I guess is does adding this mod really change the operation enough to be obvious or subtle?
New Harley bikes run lean from the factory. Often times when adding aftermarket components (such as new head pipes, slip on exhaust or high flow air-intakes) the combination can result in an even leaner running engine than what the bike comes with stock. For the most part you can safely change out the mufflers or even air intake and the ECM can adjust the AFR accordingly. However, in some cases (I've heard both 5% and 10%) the changes exceed what the ECM can compensate for. What I have been told, and read, over and over is that if you change out both the intake and the exhaust you need to add a tuner to prevent super-lean running conditions.

Of course this would also apply if changing out the head pipes or decatting the stock head pipe.

While a cooler running engine with improved "pep" are good things, I think a tuner is even more important for ensuring that your bike is running within the ideal AFR ranges and timing settings. A super lean combustion condition isn't great for the longevity or performance of your bike.
 

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From personal experience I would recommend PV or TTS. Both will work with any changes you make. If you are going to tune it yourself a PV will be slightly easier. If you are going to have it tuned, talk to the tuner that it going to do it, to see what he recommends. There's no magic bullet, anything you get is only as good as the person using it. One other thing to remember, narrow band sensors will only allow the engine to be monitored in a narrow range. If you really want to cool the engine down you have to use wide band sensors, and a system that can use them. Once you drop below .977 lambda / 14.34 afr the sensors don't work that well. They are not designed to do so. So below say .974 / 14.3 afr the ECM cannot get data from the sensors to make adjustments. But at .977 the motor runs cooler than stock, especially without a cat. Learn as much as you can about different systems, and decide how far you want to take it.
 
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