Road Glide banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Another mystery of the decade has appeared and of course it has to do with Harley Davidson and those that are associated with working on them. I don't feel that naming the shop here is relevant as they seem to treat everyone else well. Issue here is that this is the second time I've taken my bike in to get dyno work done and the second time they say they can't do anything.
First time it was that they didn't have the cable as I am using a SERT with a 9 pin in and out.
This time they had two stories for me. One being that the SERT was broken and they recommended that I buy the new TTS Pro at +/-$500. The SERT was broken according to them because they could only get the VIN off the tuner but couldnt talk to the ECM. I stated that there was no way that could be as Harley had used it not a year and half ago before my rebuild. Later in the day they came back and said that it was my ecm and I needed to go to the dealership and have the ecm flashed back to stock before they could do anything to it. When I asked why they didn't go ahead and try the new tuner he stated that he couldn't do that because we would be out of $500 if the new tuner didn't work. The bike runs ruling out the ECM in my opinion. When I went to pick up the bike they though maybe I had gotten the wrong tuner back and I said well the vin is written on the tuner here and they were like "oh it is?!" and so we checked and sure enough the two VINS checked out. Then they continued telling me stories of how the ECMs were password protected by Harley Davidson and that I would need to get it unlocked for them to work on it. Not to mention they spent hours trying to get the bike to communicate with no avail. The CD I had in the tuner box wasn't even in the box it was on the ground in the shop and I had to go get it.

Here are my thoughts to the problem:

1. There is something seriously wrong with my bike and they aren't telling me, which would then cause them to not want to work on my bike. Or they did something to it and aren't owning up to it.

2. They absolutely want me to buy the TTS Pro. but halfway through the day decided that well no that won't work.

3. The OS they are using is not compatible with the software/drivers used by the RS232 SERT?

4. The USB to 9 pin cord they are using is not communicating or the cord from the tuner to the bike they are using is not communicating. They claim to be using a "Harley" cable.

Any Ideas?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,537 Posts
Yep! It may be that the SERT isn't working correctly even though it sounds unlikely.
DUMP the SERT and don't buy another HD tuner go get a Power Vision.
The Power Vision tuner will allow you to flash tune the bikes ECM yourself which takes the HD dealer completely out of the picture.
The Power Vision is made by Dynojet which makes most dynos so most dyno techs can dyno tune your bike because they are trained to use dynojet products.
Your bike is running and everything is functioning so I would say the ECM is in good working order. On most mild builds a Power Vision flash tune is good enough and no dyno would be needed on more advanced builds a dyno tune could be beneficial.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
"I stated that there was no way that could be as Harley had used it not a year and half ago before my rebuild"

So you are saying that because it worked a year and a half ago it cannot be broken today?

I am not saying it is or isn't broken, just that your logic is very faulty....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
The software will work you just may have to run the 4.77 in compatibility mode on the newer OS (Operating Software) for this older 32 bit application. An RS232 port is just a serial port. I have had one of the 4 dongols I own of the old sert break due to cold solder joints that came apart from it rattling around in my tourpak.

If they are getting to see something in the ECM my thought is there is some communication. What happens after that would be the important part. Does it chit the bed due to software crashing, does it fail to continue to communicate through the serial port.

We are talking the Steve Cole sold SERT not the SESPT now sold by harley to be sure were talking apples to apples. The SERT was discontinued in or around the 2007-2008 model time frame.

Is the shop even using the right software to talk to it being the 4.77 version which was the last supported version?

What version of operating software is the shop doing the tuning using ... windows XP, Windows 7, windows 10 ??? Is it 32 bit or 64 bit ? Does the computer they are using even have a "real" RS232 port on it or are they converting from a usb and not using a good conversion tool like the one TTS sells which forces the right speeds etc?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
"I stated that there was no way that could be as Harley had used it not a year and half ago before my rebuild"

So you are saying that because it worked a year and a half ago it cannot be broken today?

I am not saying it is or isn't broken, just that your logic is very faulty....

I can't be broken today as all it does it sits on the shelf at the house. Nothing can happen to it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
The software will work you just may have to run the 4.77 in compatibility mode on the newer OS (Operating Software) for this older 32 bit application. An RS232 port is just a serial port. I have had one of the 4 dongols I own of the old sert break due to cold solder joints that came apart from it rattling around in my tourpak.

If they are getting to see something in the ECM my thought is there is some communication. What happens after that would be the important part. Does it chit the bed due to software crashing, does it fail to continue to communicate through the serial port.

We are talking the Steve Cole sold SERT not the SESPT now sold by harley to be sure were talking apples to apples. The SERT was discontinued in or around the 2007-2008 model time frame.

Is the shop even using the right software to talk to it being the 4.77 version which was the last supported version?

What version of operating software is the shop doing the tuning using ... windows XP, Windows 7, windows 10 ??? Is it 32 bit or 64 bit ? Does the computer they are using even have a "real" RS232 port on it or are they converting from a usb and not using a good conversion tool like the one TTS sells which forces the right speeds etc?
My tuner stays in the box on the book shelf at the house. It has been that way since I last had it tuned.
You wouldn't happen to know the baud rates, etc. for the original 9 pin sert would you? The usb to 9 pin adapter's drivers that i bought allows me to choose what com port, baud rate and other parameters.
When I talked to them today they stated that I just need the ECM flashed to stock to save the ECM because something happened to it at some point and are actually baffled that the bike still runs. They are afraid of getting to a point where theyd fry the ecm because of the inability to communicate with it or something. I dont know this is all crazy. They said otherwise theyd be able to tune it.
Now with the ECM being in "bad shape" what are the chances that when my voltage reg went out last year it jarred the memory?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
My tuner stays in the box on the book shelf at the house. It has been that way since I last had it tuned.
You wouldn't happen to know the baud rates, etc. for the original 9 pin sert would you? The usb to 9 pin adapter's drivers that i bought allows me to choose what com port, baud rate and other parameters.
When I talked to them today they stated that I just need the ECM flashed to stock to save the ECM because something happened to it at some point and are actually baffled that the bike still runs. They are afraid of getting to a point where theyd fry the ecm because of the inability to communicate with it or something. I dont know this is all crazy. They said otherwise theyd be able to tune it.
Now with the ECM being in "bad shape" what are the chances that when my voltage reg went out last year it jarred the memory?
9600 baud. If the com port is not set on your computer it will most likely be com1 or com2 might have to check the bios of the computer or right click on my computer go to manage then to device manager then to ports and look at what is listed under there.

com1 usually utilizes irq3 with settings of 03F8 com2 is usually irq4 02E8 before setting these you have to be sure you dont have a com3 or com4 already setup as they typically use the same settings e.g.

com1 same as 3
com2 usually set to same as com4 by default.

Baud Rate: 9600
Data Bits: 8
Parity: None
Stop Bits: 1
Flow Control: None
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
I can't be broken today as all it does it sits on the shelf at the house. Nothing can happen to it.
Like I said, your logic is faulty. Just because something electronic worked 18 months ago and you have not used it since does not absolutely guarantee it cannot be broke today. I troubleshoot equipment in automobile body shops and I have tested brand new equipment when we place it on the floor and then found it no longer works when we go to use it for the first time 6 months later many times.
The only time you can absolutely guarantee something works is when it is working.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Like I said, your logic is faulty. Just because something electronic worked 18 months ago and you have not used it since does not absolutely guarantee it cannot be broke today. I troubleshoot equipment in automobile body shops and I have tested brand new equipment when we place it on the floor and then found it no longer works when we go to use it for the first time 6 months later many times.
The only time you can absolutely guarantee something works is when it is working.
Im not here to get in a pissin' match over whether my logic is faulty or not. I hooked it up to my bike last night and got absolutely no error messages. I appreciate your tenacity and I see what you mean but it's truly not logical in my opinion. Thank you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
9600 baud. If the com port is not set on your computer it will most likely be com1 or com2 might have to check the bios of the computer or right click on my computer go to manage then to device manager then to ports and look at what is listed under there.

com1 usually utilizes irq3 with settings of 03F8 com2 is usually irq4 02E8 before setting these you have to be sure you dont have a com3 or com4 already setup as they typically use the same settings e.g.

com1 same as 3
com2 usually set to same as com4 by default.

Baud Rate: 9600
Data Bits: 8
Parity: None
Stop Bits: 1
Flow Control: None
Thank you Unbalanced your knowledge is quite helpful. Would you have any additional ideas as to why they are afraid to fry the ecm?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
If u have your original map you can reload it. If it works you have debunked their concerns. If it screws up your going to need a reflash and a new tuner. Could be a cya by them cause someone might of missed a step and had an issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Could be a cya? Like they screwed up on their end and aren't ready to admit it? A gotcha in other words?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Could be, not saying it is but has to be considered as an option to why.

Seems your at the Rock and hard place and being there either you try it or have another tuning shop try it
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,537 Posts
I can't see how my logic is faulty!
If everything works on your bike than the ECM is operating correctly plain and simple and your voltage regulator problem did affect the ECM at all.
If the HD shop and the indy can't get the SERT to link to or communicate with your ECM then there is a problem somewhere and the first place to look would be the SERT or the diagnostic port on the bike. All HD dealer have the software and hardware to hook up the HD race tuners no matter how old or what style the SE tuner is.
Now if you have to buy another tuner WHY would you get a SEPRT and tie yourself to the HD dealers for most all tunes and flashes to the ECM or have to buy the extra software and hardware to flash tune the bikes ECM when you can get a Power Vision tuner for less or the same amount of money which will allow you to flash tune your bike and offers more features than the SEPRT will ever have.
This is very sound logic IMO.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Forget the thundermax unless your doing a turbo. You have a pressurized manifold system use something that tunes it and has a knock sensor to save you by retarding timing when needed for heat or bad fuel etc.

PV or direct tune, then sespt.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
If none on the map files that came with the CD don't match the map that is loaded on the ecm just load the closest thing to it and tune on that?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
No I don't believe so.
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top