Road Glide banner

1 - 20 of 26 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Who's running one and are you running the A1 or the feeling, or did you make your own? I don't care about running my bike with a little less oil like the A1 recommends. I've done that on my 2013 for 7 years without issue. But why is the feeling one cost so much more. It looks like it's the same thing basically.

And for crankcase breather, are you tapping your back plate and running a couple hoses with a fitting to a small filter or what? I dig my ac but I'd like to vent both to heed off potential issues.

I'm sure one I put my cam and oil pump in pressure will go up and I still don't trust this m8 at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,550 Posts
i made my own breather out of an old broken dipstick i had laying around the garage for about $18. i bought the breather filter for $14 and brass fitting $4 at my local auto parts store. i had the fuel hose already. i drilled and tapped the oil cap and threaded in the brass fitting. i ran the hose up about 6" to an existing hole in the frame under the seat and up along front side the battery then down the left side frame and zip tied the filter to the rear saddle bag support behind the fender fascia.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
I have the Feuling vented dipstick on my 20 Special. It was given to me as a Christmas present by my Son and not installed because I was experiencing any problems! I will say, it's a beautifully made part, fit and finish. Too bad it's not more noticeable. It's been on for about 500 miles and seems to work as advertised and much easier to read oil level compared to the stock dip stick. It's machined billet aluminum and gets hot, so it's much easier to check the oil if you have a glove or rag handy.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
2,706 Posts
Interesting timing... I stumbled on some videos related to these... I was curious what our resident RG.O gear heads thought on the subject..

If I understand it correctly, some folks think that since the M8 vents back into the carb that it causes unburned oil to build up on the piston heads? am I understanding it correctly?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Well, pre M8 Harley's also are known to have blowby out the a/c. I think this depends on the bike, air cleaner, etc. The weird thing is the my 2013 with a SE Heavy Breather NEVER suffered from blowby in the air cleaner. I think that part of this is for the excess pressure that caused fluid transfer too, although that is a different cavity of the engine that is entirely separate. Fluid transfer is primary to transmission. Blowby is crankcase. Obviously the engine oil is the crank case oil.

My thinking is that with the addition of a cam in my bike and teh fact that my bike suffered fluid transfer as well until vented, this can't hurt. With the recent addition of a stage 1 I'm concerned the pressure will higher as a result of more air flow as well.

And with a cam going in shortly, I'm assuming the pressure will be greater yet again. OF the two designs (I did some research) I much prefer the fueling brand (which is almost $300. Watched some videos. I have a friend whom I think knows the guys from feuling so I'm going to see if he an help me get a deal on one.

If not, it's gonna be a bit until I have $300 for a dipstick. My thinking on this stuff is that although it may be snake oil, it might actually do what it says and it definitely won't hurt the bike. I'm also hoping a vented dipstick will help quell potential blowby from the air cleaner and maybe keep me from having to modify my back plate with vents and a filter. I've probably jsut lost my mind again, but it's definitely not the first time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
I guess no one here is into the vented dipstick thing. The fueling dipstick is on back order right now through Drag specialties so I'm going to wait this one out for a bit. Has anyone drilled and tapped their a/c backplate and run hoses to a small filter? IF so I'd like to see pics and figure out what fitting I need to do this. I dislike the idea of extra hoses and such, but I'll entertain this idea.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
547 Posts
I run the A1. A lot of my friends use their brand also. Does it work? No idea but peace of mind after watching the videos
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,155 Posts
I guess no one here is into the vented dipstick thing. The fueling dipstick is on back order right now through Drag specialties so I'm going to wait this one out for a bit. Has anyone drilled and tapped their a/c backplate and run hoses to a small filter? IF so I'd like to see pics and figure out what fitting I need to do this. I dislike the idea of extra hoses and such, but I'll entertain this idea.
If You are really interested in the Fueling Vented Dipstick check Fuel Moto they have a great price on it.
Here's a link if interested. https://www.fuelmotousa.com/series-221116-feuling-vented-dipstick-kits.html#!
Might be worth a call or email to see what they think about it.
Best of Luck!
Mike U.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I run the A1. A lot of my friends use their brand also. Does it work? No idea but peace of mind after watching the videos
Do you have the version that comes with an actual dipstick? Initially they didn't have a dipstick. I'm asking as I won't get one that doesn't have a dipstick and I dislike how the dip stick fits in. I'm concerned it could fall out into the oil pan.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,155 Posts
Do you have the version that comes with an actual dipstick? Initially they didn't have a dipstick. I'm asking as I won't get one that doesn't have a dipstick and I dislike how the dip stick fits in. I'm concerned it could fall out into the oil pan.
Here's a link to A1 Cycles A 1 cycles . net
Hope this helps.
Mike U.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,699 Posts
Who's running one and are you running the A1 or the feeling, or did you make your own? I don't care about running my bike with a little less oil like the A1 recommends. I've done that on my 2013 for 7 years without issue. But why is the feeling one cost so much more. It looks like it's the same thing basically.

And for crankcase breather, are you tapping your back plate and running a couple hoses with a fitting to a small filter or what? I dig my ac but I'd like to vent both to heed off potential issues.

I'm sure one I put my cam and oil pump in pressure will go up and I still don't trust this m8 at all.
Tapping the back plate is the best and least expensive way to do it. How exactly you do that depends on what back plate you run. The tapping and installing barbs is pretty much the same. How you block off the oem passages is what differs.

If you tap the plate on top, then you can run the hose back along the frame and down the right rear frame leg with the fuel fill drain hose. Ends up looking like it belongs there.

Don't put a filter on it. The breathers only vent out, they don't suck in.

And you don't need to use 3/8 braded line. 1/4 inch line like they sell for small engine fuel hose works fine.

If you do it nice, it looks like it came from the factory that way.

422347


And to the casual observer, its not even there.

422348
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,550 Posts
I have zero skin in the game but I do know that Beland has a lot of experience with building and racing these motors. He explains a little about what's going on with the breathing. I will say after making my own and seeing it first hand that is makes complete sense. I started my bike and watched the filter as it cranked it over you can actually see the filter "breathing" like it had it's own pulse. That was just the pressure from the down stroke of the pistons and zero to do the compression blow by. Now add that to a motor at 3k rpm for a nice highway run and you can clearly see it makes sense
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
547 Posts
Do you have the version that comes with an actual dipstick? Initially they didn't have a dipstick. I'm asking as I won't get one that doesn't have a dipstick and I dislike how the dip stick fits in. I'm concerned it could fall out into the oil pan.
Non dipstick. It was the first version.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
moThanks. I bit the bullet and bought the A1 version since it is in stock. It has the dipstick. I like the setup of the feuling better, but for another $179 more I'll see how this is for now. I'll report back once it arrives.
 

·
Registered
2019 RGU. Midnight blue/silver. “MARLIN”
Joined
·
966 Posts
moThanks. I bit the bullet and bought the A1 version since it is in stock. It has the dipstick. I like the setup of the feuling better, but for another $179 more I'll see how this is for now. I'll report back once it arrives.
I got the A1 but haven’t installed it yet. The dipstick is screwed in with red locktite so it should be fine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I got the A1 but haven’t installed it yet. The dipstick is screwed in with red locktite so it should be fine.
That red is pretty strong. Well, what's next on my list? So I want to vent my A/C too. Was looking at it tonight. I think I can do it right on top of the back plate where the breather bolts are and run a a hose under the tank and down the frame as someone else has suggested. I need to find the fittings used for this. Anyone know where to get them?
422455
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
2,706 Posts
Man... it makes sense....

But...

Not to open a can of worms, but I wonder if this will be one of those.... "you changed the EPA requirements of the bike, so your powertrain warranty is voided" things...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,699 Posts
I have zero skin in the game but I do know that Beland has a lot of experience with building and racing these motors. He explains a little about what's going on with the breathing. I will say after making my own and seeing it first hand that is makes complete sense. I started my bike and watched the filter as it cranked it over you can actually see the filter "breathing" like it had it's own pulse. That was just the pressure from the down stroke of the pistons and zero to do the compression blow by. Now add that to a motor at 3k rpm for a nice highway run and you can clearly see it makes sense
It's a shame, but he has a poor understanding of the Harley vent system.

The breathers are one way valves, they breath out, but not in. So yes, with the pistons come down they displace the same volume of air as the displacement of the motor. But when the go up, they draw a vacuum in the crankcase. That's right, negative pressure. So you do not have a big shot of air coming out each time the pistons go down. What you have is a change in pressure, neg to pos to neg, repeating every minute at the same rate as the indicated rpm. What actually gets vented is the combustion gasses that leak past the piston rings, and that's not nearly as much as most people think. At least not when the jugs and pistons rings are in good shape.

If you don't believe me, just go out to your scooter and see for yourself. Warm the scooter up and pull the air cleaner. Then pull one of the breather hoses off. You wont see much vapor being vented. At least not if your motor is in good shape. Putting a guage on that fitting is one way of seeing what sort of shape a motor is in. A little pressure is fine. But if it jumps right up and pegs a 20lb gauge, the motor needs rings.

Now with all of that said, at higher loads and speeds, there is an increase in the amount of combustion gas that works past the rings. So there will be more of it vented to the air filter box. And this will carry some oil along with it. The intent is that the oil goes down the suck hole and gets burned, be we know that doesn't always happen. This is a fault of the breather/oil separator in the head, not the function of the motor. We had a fix for it on the twin cam, we just drilled the drains to a larger size. So far we don't have a fix for the M8. I'm sure we'll get one once enough people have a chance to tinker with the breathers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,550 Posts
It's a shame, but he has a poor understanding of the Harley vent system.

The breathers are one way valves, they breath out, but not in. So yes, with the pistons come down they displace the same volume of air as the displacement of the motor. But when the go up, they draw a vacuum in the crankcase. That's right, negative pressure. So you do not have a big shot of air coming out each time the pistons go down. What you have is a change in pressure, neg to pos to neg, repeating every minute at the same rate as the indicated rpm. What actually gets vented is the combustion gasses that leak past the piston rings, and that's not nearly as much as most people think. At least not when the jugs and pistons rings are in good shape.

If you don't believe me, just go out to your scooter and see for yourself. Warm the scooter up and pull the air cleaner. Then pull one of the breather hoses off. You wont see much vapor being vented. At least not if your motor is in good shape. Putting a guage on that fitting is one way of seeing what sort of shape a motor is in. A little pressure is fine. But if it jumps right up and pegs a 20lb gauge, the motor needs rings.

Now with all of that said, at higher loads and speeds, there is an increase in the amount of combustion gas that works past the rings. So there will be more of it vented to the air filter box. And this will carry some oil along with it. The intent is that the oil goes down the suck hole and gets burned, be we know that doesn't always happen. This is a fault of the breather/oil separator in the head, not the function of the motor. We had a fix for it on the twin cam, we just drilled the drains to a larger size. So far we don't have a fix for the M8. I'm sure we'll get one once enough people have a chance to tinker with the breathers.
I totally get the whole negative/ positive pressure but as the displacement of the engines goes up so does the displaced pressure's. The breathers have been basically the same sized holes for decades. Breathing has been an issue for decades as well. The early early bikes came with vented caps. I will say the vents do help but they are not a cure all
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
433 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
422718
Sqwcrhw first sign of oil most on a pipe today. Not clear on how it really got there, bit we'll see what happens once the vented dipstick arrives. Haha he said dipstick.
 
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
Top