[fyreman]

I live just inside the Idaho state line, right across the Snake River from the SE corner of Washington state. This part of Idaho has been known as "the banana belt" of Idaho for decades. Total annual snowfall is around 6". In a few one inch snowfalls and a few flurries. The city doesn't even own a snowplow. I have touched my snow shovel twice in three winters. Total.

I'm 68, and my dad was a cop in Naperville and Elmhurst in the late 1950's, so I don't think anyone you know would have known him. I did recognize a name that he worked with on the monument for fallen officers outside the front of the main police building. I can't remember it at the moment. It may be "Gieske". I had seven bikes before I went into the military, but I wasn't riding when I lived in Naperville.

The move was definitely an adventure. My wife's folks live here, and we've been coming out on vacations for over ten years. Just fell in love with the place. Our kids are grown, and my wife's dad started having some health issues, so that was the omen that this was going to happen. Plus my mom lives in central California, so I'm closer to her as well. Everything just fell together. It really was destined to happen. We sold our home in Naperville the first morning it was listed, to the first person who looked at it, for more than we would have dreamed of getting a few years earlier. And we found our dream home here. Property taxes are a third what they were back in Illinois.

Hate to do this to you, but this is less than an hour from the house. You can see a tiny piece of the road through the trees center right.

Beautiful country. When younger I would take bike trips during the Summer (out east to Boston, then to Florida and back) to visit friends. In the Winter months I raced pro/am skiing so I got to go out west quite a bit.

Now, shorter bike trips and a little less skiing....but still enjoy both.

We're still tied here. My daughter is in New Lenox with our grandson and son is at EIU for a couple more years.

But thanks for the tease.

 

[fyreman]

Maybe you know the reason for this, I see that the date is ok on the posts, but the time is way out of wack.

My last post shows being posted at 0351 hours but it is 2151 hours here. Do all posts go Greenwich time?

 

[IdahoHacker]

The time on your last two posts is showing 7:51 pm and 7:55 pm, which is PST here. So whatever that 03:51 time was, it was an anomaly that is either just showing on your end, or it has corrected itself.

 

[Bill-RG17]

He is correct, the warranty policy has always existed and the fines for circumventing EPA compliance have always existed. So anytime in the past you've gone in with an aftermarket cam, tuner, exhaust, or other parts you are likely voiding the warranty. Whether or not the dealer gigs you on it depends on your relationship. This is true with cars, trucks, buses, etc.. A classic example is aftermarket tuners or custom exhaust systems on diesel pickups. I never let a dealer touch my bike after I ride it off the lot so not an issue for me or others that do their own work. Now, an aftermarket extended warranty may not matter as it's really just an insurance policy not in fact a warranty, but you'd have to check the individual policy language for specific terms and conditions. I did ask my dealer here in Tulsa just to get their take on it and they say no changes in the way they administer warranty on the 17s from previous years, but since I've never utilized their shop I can't speak to their policies.

My dealer said the same thing. He said as long as I stuck with them it was not in their interests to gig me. His service guys said they've never had issues with 17's warranties. I went in asking for a SE tuner and they talked me out of it. In fact they are installing slip-ons, intake and tuner as I type. Should be ready in an hour.....


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[Bill-RG17]

I had my 1K service for new '17 RGS yesterday and added SE hi airflow and told the service manager I wanted to do my own tune with Fuelpak 3. I asked him if I should flash it back to stock before I took it in. He asked around and consulted the techs. I asked about warranty risk and the message was that "they know how to talk to the MoCo when it comes to warranty issues.



Realistically, the dealerships get paid for warranty work and lose customers by unreasonably denying warranty work.

Same thing my dealer said.


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[Stick_FSMC]

I live just inside the Idaho state line, right across the Snake River from the SE corner of Washington state.

Plus my mom lives in central California, so I'm closer to her as well.

I usually stop a little south of you when I head up that way. My sister is in McCall, and I usually go up to New Plymouth for The Big Nasty Hill Climb in September.
Sure is pretty up that way. I had a buddy who just moved out of Emmett, ID and headed over to Brookings, OR. He wanted to be on the Coast.

What part of Central CA? I'm in the Sacramento, CA area myself.

 

[IdahoHacker]

Fresno area. Clovis Hi, Fresno State. My mom still lives in Coarsegold, just up 41 towards Yosemite.

 

[Cagey]

I have a question - why is everyone so afraid of voiding their warranty? Are there a lot of warranty claims being submitted?? I am still looking for a RGS or RGU, but once I do, the headers, mufflers, air, cams and tuner are all being replaced/added. I shouldn't have to worry about the powertrain breaking down if it was designed correctly, so why is everyone else so afraid? Just curious - not trying to stir the pot.

 

[IdahoHacker]

I have a question - why is everyone so afraid of voiding their warranty? Are there a lot of warranty claims being submitted?? I am still looking for a RGS or RGU, but once I do, the headers, mufflers, air, cams and tuner are all being replaced/added. I shouldn't have to worry about the powertrain breaking down if it was designed correctly, so why is everyone else so afraid? Just curious - not trying to stir the pot.

You're correct, this topic is completely overblown, primarily due to confusion.

With the exception of the '17's, you can't void a warranty. The only way the factory warranty is voided is if the bike is totaled. With the '17's, if you retune the bike with a non-EPA or non-CARB compliant tuner, then only the powertrain warranty is voided.

Where the confusion lies is in regards to a denial of a warranty claim. If you put a 150 hp engine in your bike, and leave the clutch stock, and then burn up the clutch, and then take it to the dealer and tell them it's still under warranty, then the claim for the clutch will be denied, because the failure is your fault. However, the bike's warranty is still in effect.

Personally, my bike has a SE air cleaner, Vance & Hines Pro Pipe, completely EPA illegal dyno tune, I'll probably have 50,000 miles on it before the factory warranty expires, and I'm not worried in the least.

 

[Cagey]

Okay, glad I'm not the only one that doesn't see the big deal. I plan to pick up a 2017 if I can find a leftover this season because I think I can get more performance out of the M8 engine. From what I've seen from the guys at Fuelmoto, I will be happy with the results.

 

[thealien]

Let me start by saying shit happens. Harley has opted for profit over quality as of late. There have been some reports of lifter failures taking out an engine which would be covered under the factory warranty. Non EPA tuner and they "can" deny that same claim even though one has nothing to do with the other. I believe in time someone will file and win a suit regarding this. Personally I believe Harley is complicit with the EPA and wanted this ruling to sway as many customers as they can from using any NON Harley Parts?

Do you have to put a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge exhaust on your vehicle to retain your factory warranty? No just needs to meet EPA parameters. Now aftermarket tuners are also against the law on those same vehicles and I know Chevy checks the ECM for evidence of ECM tampering and can and will deny claims. There are some tuners that claim they can be set back to stock and be undetected.

I just think we should all have all the facts before making a purchase or doing any modifications on a 2017+ Harley Davidson Motorcycle. I am happy I purchased a 2016 and have one of the last race tuners before they were all pulled from the market. While under warranty I am just doing pipes, air cleaner, and a tune to take some of the heat out. To the letter of the law even that small tune can void my warranty. At the moment they seem to be pushing the hard line on the 2017 and up bikes.

Just one mans opinion.

Remember a lot of this information comes from a company that once said synthetic oil caused bearing skate. Now their synthetic is the end all be all?

Cam chain tensioners, wheel bearings, ABS issues, crank run out? Just some of the issues of the last decade?

 

[RGKen]

Remember a lot of this information comes from a company that once said synthetic oil caused bearing skate. Now their synthetic is the end all be all?

I must have missed something throughout the years on this one. I don't remember them saying that synthetic oil, in and of itself, caused bearing skate. What I remember is that many tried, and still do in some cases, to claim that oil designed for cars and trucks would cause the skate. They try and say that you have to use oil that is MA/MA2 rated. Like I said before, I may have missed it because I just wasn't paying attention and just used whatever oil I wanted. Once I started trying to learn about oils I did fall into that belief for a bit but now I don't know if I buy the theories. :wink:

I am of the same mindset as your post though. Well put.

 

[thealien]

I must have missed something throughout the years on this one. I don't remember them saying that synthetic oil, in and of itself, caused bearing skate. What I remember is that many tried, and still do in some cases, to claim that oil designed for cars and trucks would cause the skate. They try and say that you have to use oil that is MA/MA2 rated. Like I said before, I may have missed it because I just wasn't paying attention and just used whatever oil I wanted. Once I started trying to learn about oils I did fall into that belief for a bit but now I don't know if I buy the theories. :wink:

I am of the same mindset as your post though. Well put.

There were some service advisors and dealers that would say that synthetic oils were too slippery and would not allow the bearings to spin and therefore cause "bearing skate".

I loved the deer in the headlights look when I would then ask them if the oil is too slippery to allow the bearings to spin where did the magic friction come from to cause the bearing skate or flattening of the bearing?

Before I purchase a bike or car/truck I usually have a long talk with the service department. Things like you have to use HD oil or you have to have it serviced here to keep your warranty intact will send me elsewhere and I have no problem telling them why. Some dealerships think its all about the money and don't realize they are losing some business. I guess they must make it up on the other end by fleecing the customers they keep?

 

[IdahoHacker]

Okay, glad I'm not the only one that doesn't see the big deal. I plan to pick up a 2017 if I can find a leftover this season because I think I can get more performance out of the M8 engine. From what I've seen from the guys at Fuelmoto, I will be happy with the results.

That new motor has incredible potential, and FuelMoto has a well-deserved reputation for awesome customer service.

...Non EPA tuner and they "can" deny that same claim even though one has nothing to do with the other. I believe in time someone will file and win a suit regarding this. Personally I believe Harley is complicit with the EPA and wanted this ruling to sway as many customers as they can from using any NON Harley Parts?...

If you tune your bike with a non-CARB/non-EPA compliant tuner module, your powertrain warranty IS voided, instantly. Your dealer has nothing to do with this, and cannot change it. Now, if they want to try to honor a powertrain warranty claim by lying to Milwaukee about what tuner module was used, they risk significant fines.

The Consent Decree between Harley-Davidson and the EPA has absolutely nothing to do with aftermarket parts, other than a tuner module. Under this decree, it's perfectly ok to use aftermarket parts, including non-EPA/non-CARB aftermarket parts. You just have to tune the bike with the SE Pro Street Tuner, or have the dealer flash a compliant download tune to the bike.

 

[Bill-RG17]

Personally I think if the warranty is that important to you, you probably are buying a way too expensive bike. These things ain't cheap. But if I have to replace the entire power train out of pocket. I will. I installed the fp3 yesterday and I love it. If it breaks it will be fixed one way or the other.


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[IdahoHacker]

My current plan is to keep my '15 until the fall of 2018, when the 2019's come out. By then any bugs/tweaks for the M8 will be fixed, and I'll probably be flirting with 75,000 miles on mine, and I'll be able to get a deal on an '18.

Since that will probably be the last bike I'll ever buy, (yeah...right), I'll ride it stock for a year. If nothing breaks, probably nothing will, and then I'll "make it mine."

 

[thealien]

Personally I think if the warranty is that important to you, you probably are buying a way too expensive bike. These things ain't cheap. But if I have to replace the entire power train out of pocket. I will. I installed the fp3 yesterday and I love it. If it breaks it will be fixed one way or the other.


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Painting with a pretty broad brush there?

I've paid cash for my last 3 bikes, maybe I can afford it. My last bike had thousands in warranty claims. My newest bike (2016 FLTRXS) has already had the ECM, Throttle body and all associated electronics, left switch pack, and an oil consumption issue all repaired under warranty. I'm glad you would be happy paying out of pocket for all those repairs. But just because I might be able to afford it doesn't mean I want to throw money at something that a warranty will cover!

My 2012 Silverado recently had the front differential and transfer case completely rebuilt under warranty. Why would I want to pay thousands out of pocket when I don't have to? Certainly not to prove to YOU whether I can afford it or not!

By the way fix your signature. You misspelled expert (expect).

 

[IdahoHacker]

Personally I think if the warranty is that important to you, you probably are buying a way too expensive bike. These things ain't cheap. But if I have to replace the entire power train out of pocket. I will...

What?!? Your comment is utterly nonsensical.

So, because the warranty shouldn't be "that important" to me, if a lifter fails and the motor grenades the month after I buy my new bike, I should just pay the $8,000 out of my own pocket? Am I allowed to ask the dealer if the warranty covers it, or would you interpret that as proof that I bought a bike I can't afford?

What if I paid cash? Would you allow me to use my warranty then?

 

[glideking]

I had asked about this issue with a few Harley dealers. They said the only bikes effected by this fine are the screamin eagles models with the race tuner, if you alter them. The non screamin eagles were not effected. I could be wrong. But anyway ride it till it out of warranty then make the mods this way the aftermarket companies have time to build tuner and test the mods before you get them. I am referring too ecm tuning, throttle bodies etc etc..

 

[MightyWhitey]

Personally I think if the warranty is that important to you, you probably are buying a way too expensive bike. These things ain't cheap. But if I have to replace the entire power train out of pocket. I will. I installed the fp3 yesterday and I love it. If it breaks it will be fixed one way or the other.


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??????????????????? Are you drunk....or high? God I hope it's one or the other because the third option is not fixable, according to Ron White.