I've owned a Boarzilla and Billet Cat and both of them were garbage. I should have learned a lesson from the Boarzilla but didn't. Welds breaking, pipe sliding back from the collector constantly, rust and tarnish, fitment issues.

I don't go out of my way to discourage people from buying certain things often. But when people mention getting D&D products I do what I can to point them in a different direction. Dismal product for what they charge.

 

I used to be a D&D die hard. I couldn't run a cool flow fan if I used a billet cat on the 2019 so I went with the RTX. Since that time I've actually heard little about D&D and most of what I've heard has been somewhat negative.
It's a shame their quality is suffering that bad because they were honestly one of the best. I used to promote the shit out of those things and have installed quite a few.

 

"I used to promote the shit out of those things and have installed quite a few."

No good deed goes unpunished!

 

For sometime now fuelmoto hasn't carried them , and I recall sometime back when they first starting getting scarce at FM , D&D was saying something to the effect of they weren't able to get the components they needed and weren't going to build an inferior product , or something to that effect ..

JtB

 

I am curious how EXHAUST gets back into the engine?

 

Reversion.
Reversion is when exhaust gas comes out of the cylinder and back into the combustion chamber. This can happen when the exhaust pipe is hot and expands past a certain point, blocking the exhaust pipe. When the throttle is released, the exhaust gas collects in the exhaust pipes and then back into the cylinder, detonating and creating a popping or backfiring sound. This can cause hesitation when the throttle is turned.

Reversion can be bad for performance, horsepower, and torque. To improve exhaust scavenging and create a vortex to move exhaust gas in one direction, Reinhardt builds exhaust pipes with spiral core baffles into the mufflers.

 

Even with reversion, I don’t think sand particles are going to get sucked up into the engine. Seems like a stretch to me. But I’m no expert.
How could someone prove that?

 

From what I’ve been told and had described to me, whatever material is being used to coat the insides of their exhaust is not standing up to thermal cycles and is breaking down. As reversion occurs, those pieces, shaped like grains of sand for the sake of discussion, is being pulled into the heads and cylinders. As a result, cylinder walls and pistons are being “sand blasted” and it’s causing engine / component failure.

 

I can't speak of the D&D exhausts for the M8s but I have had their Boarzilla on my 09 RG with the 124 build going on 5/6 years and I've had zero issues with it. I still get compliments on the sound. I was toying with the idea of putting the Billet Cat on my 24 RG but with this thread popping up I'll have to do more research on this issue.

 

If you see black Billet Cats on social media, look at the collector area. Rust is very common. It took one ride in rain for my Billet Cat to permanently look like a tie-died T-shirt. The muffler section on both of my units slid back even with new clamps, my ghost pipe rusted and fell off completely, my Billet Cat wore a hole through my timing cover due to a factory defect, and I'm probably still forgetting a few things. They do sound good and make good numbers. I miss my Zilla sound paired with the 630i cam.

 

I had a fat cat years ago, did not fit worth a shit and the arrogant attitude I got over the phone was enough for me to never buy from them again.

 

I could be mistaken but wasn’t D&D Exhaust sold a few years ago and The New Owners have had a lot of issues moving forward.
Mike U.

 

Can you point us to this class action lawsuit? Cant seem to find any mention of it.

 

I don’t have any more info on it than I was told there is one. Maybe it’s in the works and hasn’t been formalized yet? Not sure but I will see if I can find anything more.

 

Guess everyone needs to move towards the $3000 Feuling exhaust now. lol

I've heard that the black that they use discolors badly with sun fade. That was one of the complaints I had about my Vance and Hines 450 Torquer slip ons. They looked so much older than the OEM heat shields on the stock headers.

 

I currently have a D and D Fat Cat installed on the Heritage and a Billet Cat installed on the Roadglide. I have zero issues to report so far, as both pipes are new installs with less than one year on each pipe. I’ll keep an eye out for any signs of degradation.

I will let the group know both bikes are garage kept, never washed hot, and frequently inspected for paint chips from rock hits. I address any corrosion or rust on the spot with routine maintenance.

When I have time, I’ll try to capture some photos looking into the exhaust and post results. If I do any work requiring disassembly, I’ll do some internal photos when things are opened up to try to locate any sand, ash, or flaking condition.

Good post. Thanks for the honest feedback on D and D.

 

I get this is an FYI post and thanks for that

I’ve been toying with the idea of getting another exhaust, a you may have just schonked my fat Mellon in that direction.
I’ll use you for an excuse.

 

Well, that shoots that idea down. I was going to use their billet cat on my build. That sucks.

I can understand the arrogant attitude with being told your baby is ugly. Dont build and ugly baby, easy.

Thanks for the heads up!

 

thanks for the notice, appreciate it.

 

Thanks for the heads up and so disappointing to hear this from a timing perspective as I just had my bike dyno tuned last month. What would ya'll recommend I replace my billet cat with? I currently have a 21 RGS with 114, star 30/30 cam, 64mm SE intake/throttle body, and SE ventilator extreme. I would like to stick with a 2 into 1 but will want a ghost pipe option to fill the gap on the left side if I do.

 

Well, since I have a Jackpot ghost pipe for sale, I recommend the Jackpot 2:1 Black exhaust.

Jackpot RTX 2 Into 1 Exhaust with Heat Shields Black Cerakote Milwaukee-8

 

I am definitely waffling on the finish too since mine is mostly all black, but thinking it might be an interesting contrast. Decisions Decisions

 

Do it!
Go with the contrast!

 

I spoke with @lbskis and he agreed we should put something out there for the forum. It has come to our attention from other shops we know and other tuners we know of a potential issue that is arising on bikes running D&D exhausts. Apparently, the coating D&D puts on the INSIDE of their exhausts is breaking down / flaking off and the debris is turning into sand for lack of a better comparison. That trash is then going through the engine. From what we’ve been told, there is even a class action lawsuit in the works because D&D has said these failures are not their fault. We know of a couple Dyno tuners that are already refusing to tune bikes with D&D exhaust for fear of how a failure could look like they (the tuner) caused it. We know of a major company that has already returned all prototype exhausts and all in stock exhaust to D&D. I am not looking to start a debate or argument and don’t have time for it. I just simply wanted to put info I’ve been given, out to forum members.

this has happened to me to. Motorcycle smoking after I had Dd 2to 1 billet cat exhaust installed.please inform me where the class action lawsuit has been filed EDIT TO REMOVE PERSONAL INFORMATION

 

this has happened to me to. Motorcycle smoking after I had Dd 2to 1 billet cat exhaust installed.please inform me where the class action lawsuit has been filed

 

I find that the only place I can find any claims of coating material causing engine damage by a D&D Exhaust ( which I am skeptical of) is on this site. Also the claim of a class action lawsuit doesn't seem to have any merit either.Hopefully someone from D&D will see all this and address this accusation, if in fact, it really is an issue. Because of right now it seems a little one sided, and lacks any definitive proof.
I have no skin in the game, but I don't like seeing companies bashed merely by hearsay and assumptions. If it's true, so be it.

 

I find that the only place I can find any claims of coating material causing engine damage by a D&D Exhaust ( which I am skeptical of) is on this site. Also the claim of a class action lawsuit doesn't seem to have any merit either.Hopefully someone from D&D will see all this and address this accusation, if in fact, it really is an issue. Because of right now it seems a little one sided, and lacks any definitive proof.
I have no skin in the game, but I don't like seeing companies bashed merely by hearsay and assumptions. If it's true, so be it.

Ease up, the title states"warning" and the poster stated that "from what we've been told" there is a class action lawsuit in the works. Nobody condemned the company to Hell..... at least yet. He is speaking from real world experience and bringing his findings to us, his FAMILY, so it keeps our head on a swivel and that much more educated before we go spending our hard earned money on something that could potentially bite us.

 

I debated between D&D and FulSac. Decided on FulSac because I could use my Tabs. The 2-1-2 sounds great. Real quality pipes that fit perfect and used my stock shields. Looks like I finally came out on the right side for once.

 

Struggling to understand how a coating inside the exhaust ends up inside the engine?

 

reply #6 has a video with an explanation

 

I am an owner of a 2019 roadglide that this has happened to twice after Rusty from D&D was adament there was nothing wrong with the pipe and blamed everything and everybody but the pipe. Would like to know more about the class actio lawsuit. Bike is currently in Daytona being rebuilt again

 

Yeah, you can keep your cold ass weather up there! We don’t do well with that crap. It’s bad when we bitch about 1/4” of ice, but we will!!!

 

Well, with that said, I’ll err on the side of caution.
I’m Dyno’d with my Billet cat. I think the side winder is probably the closest match with the right baffle. Going into summer, a dyno run is a little bit down the road.

soooooo, who’s having some good prices on systems?

thanks for looking out.

 

Well, with that said, I’ll err on the side of caution.
I’m Dyno’d with my Billet cat. I think the side winder is probably the closest match with the right baffle. Going into summer, a dyno run is a little bit down the road.

soooooo, who’s having some good prices on systems?

thanks for looking out.

Love my Sidewinder, but if I was you, I'd pull the header and see what it looks like and then proceed from there. If it looks like it's good. Do you have access to a bore scope? Pull the muffler and take a peek.

 

I went to order a d&d 2-1 and the place I ordered from said i shouldn’t order one because of this issue !!!! So ordered a khrome werkes outlaw 2-1

The shop wasn’t trying to sell me another exhaust they told me I can order it still but wanted to warn me and if I wanted to go another route they said just pick another one so i picked the outlaw 2-1 in eclipse finish

they said one of there customers went thru 3 motors and they finally realized it was the exhaust !! They threw another exhaust on and hasn’t had a new motor since

they also said a lawsuit was in the works but reading this forum doesn’t look like its
Getting any traction 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

So for the people saying it’s only happening in this forum

 

As far as our shop goes, I want my guys to help customers make smart decisions like the shop employees did where you went. I want my guys to use their personal experience with products to help customers make decisions. And if they have real info regarding issues with any products, I would want them to mention it to the customer. When customers listen, the entire transaction usually goes better. Sounds like you went to a stand up shop.

 

Yep. 1300$ wall art. Still cheaper then another wife.

 

I would check around for a service that could eliminate that internal coating, maybe by chemical or blasting. I don't think they have to become boat anchors, but you may have to spend a few bucks to salvage them.